Piracy: Common Myths

[TotalInsanity4]

Looks like someone failed 4th grade English.

Theft by definition requires that you've taken or removed something.

The first post is worded a bit oddly in favour of pirating, however it's still correct.
I don't think anyone was saying piracy is okay because it isn't theft (well some have, but they're morons). It's just not, by definition, theft. I think that's just your entitlement flaring up because you apparently don't pirate games.

Unfortunately no matter how entitled you act, you can't and won't be changing the definition of the word 'theft' to suit your needs here. You just look ignorant.

steal
[stēl]
VERB

1. take (another person's property) without permission or legal right and without intending to return it

Whoops

 

[SoslanVanWieren]

problem is nearly every one does it so thats why its not enforced as much as other laws or millons of people would be fined.

 

[SoslanVanWieren]

problem is nearly every one does it so thats why its not enforced as much as other laws or millons of people would be fined.

 

[BlueFox gui]

look in my opinion...
fuck devs and other things LOL
i will pirate forever and i don't care, never had any problem

 

[TotalInsanity4]

problem is nearly every one does it so thats why its not enforced as much as other laws or millons of people would be fined.

It's like jaywalking, it's used to be able to convict someone in the event they're caught for something else

 

[Deleted User]

This thread has opened my eyes, and I don't know if it was in a good way or bad way.

 

[Zaphod77]

Myth: The term piracy (with regards to copyright infringement) was invented by the MPAA/RIAA/etc. in the 20th century.

Fact: The term predates copyright law, and was used with regards to unauthorized copying of printed works in the 17th century. It was just as pejoratively intended then as it is now.

http://www.luminarium.org/renascence-editions/yeare.html

As soon as software on magnetic media was developed, the term software piracy was invented shortly after it started happening.

 

[CosmoConstant]

I like piracy!

 

[jack44556677]

I am mostly just posting because I cannot share my work here until I post 5 times

I did not read through this whole thread, so my apologies in advance if this has already been mentioned.

Firstly, great thread! And excellent list of both the distinction between piracy and theft, as well as the debunking of many misconceptions (some of which I had myself, like the "physical copy/ownership rule".

Many criminals (drug dealers mostly) are under a whopper of a misconception that if they ask someone if they are a cop, that they MUST tell them honestly if they are. Once upon a time, this was true - and it OUGHT to still be true today - however there is no active precedent/legal recourse for entrapment anymore. "Stings", including where undercover cops encourage people to commit crimes (or simply say they are interested in doing so) and this is a "clean bust" according to our fantastically corrupt and evil "law"/"legal system"/"justice system" (quotes for offensive euphemism). This VERY much includes when authorities host files for you to download (some of which have no copyright content within them at all, merely the name of a copyrighted work, and then steal your money (all legal theft of course, but theft is theft regardless of "legal infrastructure"/how it is conducted.

Another point I should like to add is about the DMCA. I encourage people to check out "Nirvana the band the show" and learn about the lawyer they have representing them (the same lawyer responsible for beating disney at their own corrupt usury game with the movie "Escape from Tomorrow" which was filmed at disneyland while paying NO rights/fees to anyone - much to evil disney's shagrin).

Law is heinously/impossibly/unfathomably complex, which is one of the reasons you can't use "i didn't know" as a defense. You are guilty until proven innocent, and all that must be done is for a corporation or other "authority" of any kind to point the finger at you. That said, in the intentional obfuscatory complexity is "leeway" (IF AND ONLY IF YOU CAN AFFORD THE COMPETENT LEGAL COUNCIL, which virtually no-one can). In the case of the DMCA, there is a blanket of "fair use" which is a MUCH larger shield than people recognize. The aforementioned lawyer has been extremely successful in setting precedent in courts that using your materials (whether purchased movies / games / music or just things you experienced that made a large emotional impact on you and is a part of you and your history as a result) is your right, and there isn't a gosh darn thing the devil and his worshipers (working tirelessly to make sharing and caring expressly illegal in every way) can do about it - again, for now - and only with the requisite expensive legal council. Although not expressly stated, I believe the spirit of most copyright law (usually only relevant/impactful in supreme court cases) is that "piracy" as a criminal/civil offense must involve monetary harm or monetary gain. Sadly, this is not something the judge will want to hear about but there is always the EXTREMELY remote chance you will get a judge with a working heart and some remnants of their human soul left. I just red about a local pta that was fined 250 bucks for showing the lion king to some kids on school property, we live in very sad times.

 

[TifelMyers]

Doesn't the fine if you are caught pirating differ per country?

 

[Zaphod77]

Sadly, fair use doesn't actually provide a defense against the DMCA. That's why they have to make individual exemptions to it.

See DeCSS.

Incidentally, hosting pirated files as a sting doesn't actually work outside of a torrent in most countries, and here's why.

The reason is intent cannot be proven purely from a download.

Sure, you probably are intending to pirate. But that can't be proven. You could be checking it out to make sure it's actually an illegal copy before reporting it to the copyright owner, and then deleting it from your computer. (and if someone does come to investigate, you can delete it before they get there and easily claim that very thing and the claim can't be disproven) You could be investigating it to see if the crack contains a virus, so you know whether to detect it. You could be building up a library without using the pirated software. (many people do this) As long as you do not distribute it, and do not install it, you have caused zero harm to the copyright holder. The copyright people know this. Any damages from your download are 100% speculation, and the courts have forbidden companies from collecting on them.

Back in the days of using public ftp sits for piracy, it was always the uploaders that got in trouble, and not the downloaders. After all, even if you are the copyright holder, you have to download the software yourself to see what it really is. Anyone who tries to persecute just downloading will have to gnash their teeth and admit they have nothing they can ding you with, unless they have spyware on your computer. Most countries take a very dim view of that. Sure you can try to make your software phone home to verify licensed use, but better not be any false positives...

The reason you get dinged while torrenting/peer to peering is because you also engage in distribution of the copyrighted media/software, and that doesn't require intent to be proven for damages. In this case ignorance doesn't protect you. They have proof that you transmitted parts of the copyrighted work. And as the copyright owner, they are allowed to join in to find this out.

 

[SkeletonSmith]

"Someone" in our family (stares at uncle) hacked our wii and pirated every wii game in existence and i only recently learned the wii was hacked when i hacked it myself and saw some cache on the nanf

 

[dAVID_]

Sadly, fair use doesn't actually provide a defense against the DMCA. That's why they have to make individual exemptions to it.

See DeCSS.

Incidentally, hosting pirated files as a sting doesn't actually work outside of a torrent in most countries, and here's why.

The reason is intent cannot be proven purely from a download.

Sure, you probably are intending to pirate. But that can't be proven. You could be checking it out to make sure it's actually an illegal copy before reporting it to the copyright owner, and then deleting it from your computer. (and if someone does come to investigate, you can delete it before they get there and easily claim that very thing and the claim can't be disproven) You could be investigating it to see if the crack contains a virus, so you know whether to detect it. You could be building up a library without using the pirated software. (many people do this) As long as you do not distribute it, and do not install it, you have caused zero harm to the copyright holder. The copyright people know this. Any damages from your download are 100% speculation, and the courts have forbidden companies from collecting on them.

Back in the days of using public ftp sits for piracy, it was always the uploaders that got in trouble, and not the downloaders. After all, even if you are the copyright holder, you have to download the software yourself to see what it really is. Anyone who tries to persecute just downloading will have to gnash their teeth and admit they have nothing they can ding you with, unless they have spyware on your computer. Most countries take a very dim view of that. Sure you can try to make your software phone home to verify licensed use, but better not be any false positives...

The reason you get dinged while torrenting/peer to peering is because you also engage in distribution of the copyrighted media/software, and that doesn't require intent to be proven for damages. In this case ignorance doesn't protect you. They have proof that you transmitted parts of the copyrighted work. And as the copyright owner, they are allowed to join in to find this out.

Deleting a file is not a guarantee that it can't be recovered. Usually, operating systems don't actually overwrite the file with 0's, so it is possible to recover a file even if you deleted it. To my knowledge, in the United States, redistributing copyrighted content is not a requisite for copyright infringement, so you could be prosecuted even if you don't share your warez or if you set your upload speed to 0 in your BitTorrent client. Either way, companies usually go after large sites rather than individuals.
The reason why your ISP will send you love letters if they think you're torrenting is simply because they don't want to be held liable for copyright infringement. This might not be true for every country, though.
Fortunately, in my country (Mexico), copyright laws are very loose. Here, copyright infringement is only a criminal offense if it is done with the intent to make a profit.

 

[MetoMeto]

"Copyright on modern (1978 and newer) works lasts 70 years past the author's death,
or 95-120 years for an anonymous work. Whether it's still sold or not has no bearing on this."

This is a total bullshit if you ask me. I question the sanity of people making copyright laws in the first place!
But hey, we have no choice but to do what the "law" is saying...

 

[MasterJ360]

There are far better ways to pirate than torrenting, not using a vpn via torrent is like unprotected sex.
Among the reports on Nintendo shutting down sites only the site owner gets punished not the downloaders. I don't think I've heard a bigger piracy case than the Megaupload incident that got the FBI involved.

 

[Zaphod77]

Deleting a file is not a guarantee that it can't be recovered. Usually, operating systems don't actually overwrite the file with 0's, so it is possible to recover a file even if you deleted it.

Yes, but all they can prove even then is that you extracted the file, and tested the installer. not that you actually used the software for any significant amount of time. Just because you downloaded the file doesn't prove you pirated.

Again, you generally cannot get in trouble just for downloading. Distribution is where you run into trouble, which can't be avoided while torrenting properly.

 

[dAVID_]

Yes, but all they can prove even then is that you extracted the file, and tested the installer. not that you actually used the software for any significant amount of time. Just because you downloaded the file doesn't prove you pirated.

Again, you generally cannot get in trouble just for downloading. Distribution is where you run into trouble, which can't be avoided while torrenting properly.

Re-distributing copyrighted works isn't a requisite for copyright infringement under U.S. law.

 

[Jayinem81]

Myth: You will go to hell for piracy


Actually that is true.

 

[dAVID_]

Myth: You will go to hell for piracy


Actually that is true.

YOU WOULDN'T POST A MEME THAT CONTAINS COPYRIGHTED CONTENT TO AN INTERENT FORUM

 

[Zaphod77]

Re-distributing copyrighted works isn't a requisite for copyright infringement under U.S. law.

True. but again... they can't PROVE it if you don't distribute.

They can't even prove it wasn't planted. Innocent until proven guilty for criminal cases. And there are court rulings on speculative damages.

Proving download doesn't prove any copyright violation on the part of the downloader.