A canonical story is a story which follows on from established events and worlds in previous works. If a story does something which contradicts previous works held to be in the same universe then it is said to break with canon. Canon can be useful as it allows you to establish a story and explore it over many works, and it can be troubling in that it then restricts you as you have to make new characters, technology/magic and events work within the established logic lest you be accused of violating canon. In games you have the further problem that you are either prevented from doing multiple endings, having to establish a "canonical ending" in any sequel or find yourself having to do a lot of extra story writing and level design that may never get seen.
It is possible to retroactively make works non canon, in games one such thing being the Castlevania handheld games when later entries in the franchise hit.

Zelda Breath of the Wild has been seeing some discussions recently and some of the more interesting criticisms concerns "the timeline". Now it was the understanding of many that a few games might have had direct sequels, Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask for instance, but for the most part it was a common theme that the developers could use to make a story. In films such a thing is seen in James Bond where a given James Bond might revisit locations and characters but as a whole it is treated more as a setup for a story, the setup however being one that everybody knows.
In more recent years though a "timeline" for Zelda was attempted to be constructed by fans, though as the series features time travel it was less of a time line and more of a time flow chart, and as the timeline creators seem to opt for the many-worlds interpretation of quantum mechanics... for something less complex maybe look at street fighter sequels. Nintendo was seemingly hesitant to give the seal of approval for any such timeline, or provide their own, and thus we are back at it being a worldbuilding setup but not necessarily a story one. Breath of the Wild then being something of a rejection of the timeline idea in the eyes of some.

Other examples in games. The Dead Rising series saw a completely non canon/reimagining of the second game to instead star the seemingly beloved character from the first game in Dead Rising 2: Off the Record. Such alternate universes/what if scenarios can also play on some established lore but subvert it such that those playing with an understanding of previous works may get to experience something anew. In computer games the latter is less common but it is a long established practice within pen and paper role playing games that may be based on an established work.

Thus far we have not even brought up the ideas of alternate universes (immensely popular in comics), different vantage points/while this was happening (some of the Crysis sequels and spinoffs being this, Resident Evil also playing with this on several occasions, even within the same game), unreliable narrators, and fan works (sometimes referred to as fanon).

This is a new feature on GBAtemp where we discuss and explore concepts, mechanics and similar things found within games. We already have a very long list of things to cover but suggestions and guest spots are welcome.

To that end what are your feelings on canon within games? How important is it to you? Do you have a different interpretation of any of the points brought up? Do you have any favourite examples of use, abuse or misuse of canon within games? Any examples where you felt things trying to adhere to canon hobbled the resulting game?

 

[ars25]

I really think that the canon is important, but not something to be deemed as the most important thing in a game.

Taking Zelda as an example, the fanbase worries more with the series' timeline than the creators themselves (as Aonuma stated himself, the timeline was created with all of the fan commotion behind it in mind). Almost all the games from the series can be played in any order, with literally any of them being needed to understand the other games. I really do think it's nice to have an official timeline as it really improves the experience IMO, but it's not ultimately necessary in this case, as the games aren't made with the necessity of knowing what happened at the prior games in mind.

Kingdom Hearts on the other hand is the opposite. It directly follows the past games, being related to every past event. The main problem is that Nomura heavily relies on plotholes to release more material and "buy more time" to think on something instead of develop the story further in a better way. Luckily the final result is good enough, and the gameplay remains solid as ever.

But canon have it's issues. Depending on the game, the publisher can "change it's canon" for the sake of marketing and sales. For an example, we have Street Fighter 2010, which was a very bad move from Capcom US trying to sell the game relying on another IP.

The main problem with the canon IMO is the inability of some people to differ canon from easter eggs/fanservice. You can shot down a Rathalos in MGS Peace Walker, but it doesn't mean they're part of the same world. Overwatch is literally packed with stuff from several Blizzard games, but it doesn't mean they share the same universe. It really pains me everytime a new fan theory is brought to light just because the game creators wanted to please the fans with a little easter egg.






Actually, no. A heartless is born when someone loses his/her heart, the heart being taken by the darkness within it and turning into a Heartless itself. What happens with the Nobodies is that, if they are strong willed enough, their body and soul "remains together" after losing his/her heart.

Sora isn't exactly a good example for this as he had (at one point at least) three hearts (two and a half, to be more specific) within him, this being the reason behind Roxas appearance when Sora became a heartless. As Kairi is one of the Princesses of Hearts, she could erase all the darkness in Sora's heart, making him return to his normal self again (and being a Princess of Hearts, her heart can't turn into a Heartless).

But as Sora's Nobody (which is Ven's Nobody technically speaking) continued without his heart, he kept existing. With Naminé is a little bit more complicated, as she's a Nobody of both Kairi's heart and Sora's body and soul.

To quote you on Nomura relieing on plot holes for the KH series thing seem to come from the first game being written with no real sequels in mind since they weren't probably sure if Disney would've green lit another one.Thats probably one of the many reasons for the "plotholes' or retcons in later instalments. As for the heartless thing i complete agree with you, and regarding the roxas point you made Roxas is sora nobody and the only reason why he looks like ven is due to the influience his heart had which is referenced here by nomura https://forums.khinsider.com/birth-sleep/147019-20-kh-mysteries-solved-sort.html .

 

[thewarhammer]

To quote you on Nomura relieing on plot holes for the KH series thing seem to come from the first game being written with no real sequels in mind since they weren't probably sure if Disney would've green lit another one.Thats probably one of the many reasons for the "plotholes' or retcons in later instalments. As for the heartless thing i complete agree with you, and regarding the roxas point you made Roxas is sora nobody and the only reason why he looks like ven is due to the influience his heart had which is referenced here by nomura https://forums.khinsider.com/birth-sleep/147019-20-kh-mysteries-solved-sort.html .

The problem is that the plotholes were only increasing in number as the games were being released, without . I can be wrong, but it seemed to me that he did with KH3D the same Tite Kubo did with Bleach's final arc.

Well, Roxas IS Sora's Nobody, but both Ven's and Sora's hearts are merged with each other. So, technically speaking, Roxas can also be considered Ven's Nobody.

This is even said in the interview you've posted above. In fact, the interview answers a few questions regarding this fact:


"Q2: Why did Roxas faint in Castle Oblivion on Day 297?
A: Because he had gotten to close to both Sora and Ventus, his "real self".

Before Day 297 in Days Sora had been to Castle Oblivion, as well as the fact that Ventus is asleep somewhere in the Room of Awakening. Both Sora and Ventus can be called Roxas' "real selves", and when he felt their presence it made him faint.

When Roxas went to Castle Oblivion the memories of his "real selves" made him confused.

Ventus asleep in a room in the castle.


Q3: Is it possible that Roxas has a heart?
A: It is thought that it could be Ventus' heart.

In KHII FM there were clues to him having a heart, and in Days we saw Roxas crying--proof that he could have a heart. As was said in Q1, he has taken a lot of himself from Ventus. But perhaps when Sora and Roxas were separated, Ventus' heart stayed in Roxas?

On Day 357, Roxas cries after losing his friend Xion.

Sora links with Ventus to help heal him.


Q4: Why can Roxas dual-wield?
A: Because he can use both Sora's and Ventus' keyblades.

Sora can wield two keyblades at once because he has Ventus' as well as his own. As Roxas is a part of Sora, he also can use two. In Days Roxas awakened his ability to dual wield after fighting Xion. In KHII once Sora absorbs him, he can also dual-wield.

Roxas awakens his ability to dual-wield with his will to not forget Xion who also wielded a keyblade."

 

[ars25]

The problem is that the plotholes were only increasing in number as the games were being released, without . I can be wrong, but it seemed to me that he did with KH3D the same Tite Kubo did with Bleach's final arc.

Well, Roxas IS Sora's Nobody, but both Ven's and Sora's hearts are merged with each other. So, technically speaking, Roxas can also be considered Ven's Nobody.

This is even said in the interview you've posted above. In fact, the interview answers a few questions regarding this fact:


"Q2: Why did Roxas faint in Castle Oblivion on Day 297?
A: Because he had gotten to close to both Sora and Ventus, his "real self".

Before Day 297 in Days Sora had been to Castle Oblivion, as well as the fact that Ventus is asleep somewhere in the Room of Awakening. Both Sora and Ventus can be called Roxas' "real selves", and when he felt their presence it made him faint.

When Roxas went to Castle Oblivion the memories of his "real selves" made him confused.

Ventus asleep in a room in the castle.


Q3: Is it possible that Roxas has a heart?
A: It is thought that it could be Ventus' heart.

In KHII FM there were clues to him having a heart, and in Days we saw Roxas crying--proof that he could have a heart. As was said in Q1, he has taken a lot of himself from Ventus. But perhaps when Sora and Roxas were separated, Ventus' heart stayed in Roxas?

On Day 357, Roxas cries after losing his friend Xion.

Sora links with Ventus to help heal him.


Q4: Why can Roxas dual-wield?
A: Because he can use both Sora's and Ventus' keyblades.

Sora can wield two keyblades at once because he has Ventus' as well as his own. As Roxas is a part of Sora, he also can use two. In Days Roxas awakened his ability to dual wield after fighting Xion. In KHII once Sora absorbs him, he can also dual-wield.

Roxas awakens his ability to dual-wield with his will to not forget Xion who also wielded a keyblade."

Your misinterpreting those statements what they are saying.
Q2 stated that due to Roxas being Sora's nobody while also harboring vens heart being in such close proximity to them made him faint. As Ventus' heart was reacting to his comatose body and Roxas being reacting to Sora's heart.
Q3 was just saying Roxas has ven's heart
Q4 Was explaining how Roxas and sora can dual wield keyblades
Also Sora is harboring Ventus' Heart it's not merged with his at this current moment. The only time they merged hearts was at the beginning of bbs and that was because Ventus' heart was fractured by xehanort.

 

[thewarhammer]

Your misinterpreting those statements what they are saying.
Q2 stated that due to Roxas being Sora's nobody while also harboring vens heart being in such close proximity to them made him faint. As Ventus' heart was reacting to his comatose body and Roxas being reacting to Sora's heart.
Q3 was just saying Roxas has ven's heart
Q4 Was explaining how Roxas and sora can dual wield keyblades
Also Sora is harboring Ventus' Heart it's not merged with his at this current moment. The only time they merged hearts was at the beginning of bbs and that was because Ventus' heart was fractured by xehanort.

There isn't any risk of misinterpretation when it says "Both Sora and Ventus can be called Roxas' "real selves", and when he felt their presence it made him faint.

When Roxas went to Castle Oblivion the memories of his "real selves" made him confused."

It CLEARLY says both of them can be considered his real self. There's nothing more to say about it.

 

[Deleted User]

I love when a game just thrusts you into battle or whatever, and the story slowly reveals itself to you subtly, without much hand-holding and at a good pace, keeping you interested. I also love exploring the lore of games, like Splatoon. Lore gives you more places to branch out into, should they ever make prequel games.

I can see that. A good story (in a video game) should hook you, then have you work to uncover more about the plot.

 

[FAST6191]

I love when a game just thrusts you into battle or whatever, and the story slowly reveals itself to you subtly, without much hand-holding and at a good pace, keeping you interested. I also love exploring the lore of games, like Splatoon. Lore gives you more places to branch out into, should they ever make prequel games.

I am not sure that is canon per se.
Thrusting you into a story (possibly with an equivalent to a high level character so you get a taste of what is to come) is a nice way to start some games. If you mean just dropping you into a story and going from there then if you want a term to have for it then "in medias res".

I'd say there's four types of games/series in relationship to canon:

1) Games that try to tell an involved story through a collection of works exploring a lot of different ideas that are often in conflict with each other. Done well, this invariably has include things like unreliable narrator and mythos/rumor. Few games actually try this and most that do fall short, but most people tend to gloss over it because of the difficulty of writing such a work.

Trying to think of games that do this. Plenty of books do this*, indeed such things usually end up being among my favourite, but other than games based on those books (and it is rarely reflected mechanically) I'm at a loss.

*for all else that might be said about him Brandon Sanderson is a master at this.

 

[Deleted User]

I am not sure that is canon per se.
Thrusting you into a story (possibly with an equivalent to a high level character so you get a taste of what is to come) is a nice way to start some games. If you mean just dropping you into a story and going from there then if you want a term to have for it then "in medias res".

There is a trope for the former. What I think they're trying to get at, though, is that the game should hook you with a bit of gameplay first, then slowly introduce you to the story as time goes on. While hardly an example of a deep and intricate story, Sonic Colors does this by just dropping you into the first level without any explanation so you can get a feel for the gameplay first, then introduce you to the story as the game goes on.

Another example that comes to mind is Kingdom Hearts, at least, from a certain perspective. As a kid, I had trouble following the game's objectives, so I would often spend my time wandering around, wondering what to do next. Because of these prolonged periods of wandering aimlessly and/or trying to beat a certain boss, it made story progression and cutscenes all the more rewarding. That being said, something along these lines can't really be replicated with success these days, due to the prevalence of the internet and walkthroughs/guides, as well as the aging demographic of the video game industry; many of these people don't have as much as time as they used to, and probably aren't willing to spend it wandering around a game aimlessly when they could be doing other things.

 

[kuwanger]

Trying to think of games that do this. Plenty of books do this*, indeed such things usually end up being among my favourite, but other than games based on those books (and it is rarely reflected mechanically) I'm at a loss.

Xenosaga would come to mind, maybe? Boktai could be considered too. I'd tend to argue the Tales of games tend to follow somewhere between (2) and (3). Yea, it's really hard to find examples of (1) because it's mostly a given that games are supposed to be fully self-contained. Or that even those that have the scope to try such things (Mega Man X/Zero comes to mind) quickly devolve into (2) or (4) because the people in charge of the story are rarely allowed to carry over from game to game (look at X6's story). ZX might qualify as (1) merely because it's effectively been cancelled as a series. I'm not quite sure where the Metal Gear Solid or Resident Evil series fits.

tl;dr (1) is generally only doable if there's one person in charge, so it's little wonder it almost only happens well with books.

 

[Pomegrenade]

i only clicked on this thread, cuz i saw the old Tempy mascot art LOL @FAST6191

 

[Hells Malice]

I'm very invested in canon in regards to story and lore heavy games. I'll be going through Valkyria Chronicles 4 with a fine toothed comb, having read all of the design archives and adoring the lore. Hell it didn't even have to tell me any details in the trailer, I already spotted them just by looking.

But in most games, canon means nothing. I don't care about Zelda canon. The timeline is cute and it kinda works if you squint a bit and let go of any harsh judgements, but at the end of the day it really doesn't matter because none of the games actually try to connect to eachother. Only OOT/MM and the DS abominations were intentionally tied afair off the top of my head.

Games like Dead Rising and stuff are so devoid of any lore or real story, that they can do whatever they want. The best way to play Dead Rising 2 was with Frank West.