Nintendo is going after the development team of an emulator. A legal case was filed by Nintendo yesterday, alleging that the Nintendo Switch emulator, Yuzu, has caused damages to the company by allowing for its games to be played illegally before release. The suit also claims that the company behind the emulator, Tropic Haze LLC, makes a profit by facilitating piracy, noting that during the leak of The Legend of Zelda: Tears of the Kingdom, Yuzu's Patreon saw a large increase in users. Nintendo's legal team makes a case that Tropic Haze profits from and popularizes video game piracy.

NEW: Nintendo is suing the creators of popular Switch emulator Yuzu, saying their tech illegally circumvents Nintendo's software encryption and facilitates piracy.
Seeks damages for alleged violations and a shutdown of the emulator. pic.twitter.com/SGZVI6Cs0x

— Stephen Totilo (@stephentotilo) February 27, 2024

In the legal document, Nintendo refers to an emulator as, "a piece of software that allows users to unlawfully play pirated video games". They also assert that the Yuzu team is aware of the emulator's use in the context of piracy, and do not try to hide that aspect. In addition, Nintendo's legal team states that extracting your own keys from a Nintendo Switch console--a requirement to run any Nintendo Switch emulator--is illegal.

Source

 

[Wolfy]

go on there twiiter and say that.

Nah, a single post is all I care to do, that and download the latest build to further enjoy playing their games with my legally dumped games.

Also don't use social media, forums are the most I touch.

 

[smf]

The fact that the law is not in Nintendo's favor here must've had them seething for quite a while. It still isn't in their favor with this Yuzu case, for that matter, which is why they're taking a different approach with a trial by jury. They're hoping to select mostly tech-illiterate jurors, but all it takes is one person armed with the knowledge that v1 Switch units can be exploited using just a paperclip to shut this whole thing down. By the letter of the law, Nintendo's anti-piracy/security measures must be EFFECTIVE for bypassing them to be considered illegal.

They can't just be exploited with a paper clip, though tech-illiterate people might believe you.

Hopefully the legal fees will use up all the patreon money.

There's also the case that drm via private keys does not seem to exist during that time so the case for decryption of roms has not been tested.

It's no different to decryption of dvd/bluray/live sports streams etc without permission.

The US courts seem to stand by the console market, but we'll see how it plays out. I'm surprised they haven't done this sooner, or treated them like GaryOPA.

Post automatically merged: Mar 1, 2024

This has to be an attempt to stall and bankrupt them with lawyer costs. Because legally they have no case. The encryption mode in the ROMs, and in general in other DRM'd media, can be decrypted using freeware tools. Yuzu is doing nothing unusual here, it's the key that's the essential part, and they aren't distributing that. This has been tested in courts before. The emulation portion is also backed by precedent.

Distributing the key is irrelevant, even telling people what algorithm the key needs to be used with to decrypt switch games is illegal.

There is an argument that yuzu thought they could get away with it because the information is widely available. I'm not going to guess how it will play out in court. Though of course the end result could by suing them out of existence, which wouldn't be a bad thing. Too much money and publicity in what they are doing.

 

[Lumstar]

Meanwhile Nintendo uses emulators themselves in the Virtual Console, Switch Online, Mini Classics, even Super Mario 3D All Stars uses emulation. If that's not hypocritical I don't know what is.

Post automatically merged: Feb 29, 2024

Nintendo is trying to play the semantics game. Commercial products are usually not promoted as emulation. Most of the time, the word "emulator" won't appear in any official descriptions or advertising material.

 

[TheBarbiter01]

go on there twiiter and say that.

*their

Post automatically merged: Mar 1, 2024

Nintendo, I hope you read this one message.

Fuck off with ya. You making less than 1% of revenue isn't going to even be on your radar. Your demographic is still happily eating all the shit you come out with up so keep up the good work with that!

 

[ItsAshleyFTW]

Nintendo is trying to play the semantics game. Commercial products are usually not promoted as emulation. Most of the time, the word "emulator" won't appear in any official descriptions or advertising material.

The software Nintendo uses can definitely be called an emulator though. Oxford Learners Dictionary defines emulator as: "a device or piece of software that makes it possible to use programs, etc. on one type of computer even though they have been designed for a different type." Assuming "programs" refers to ROMs and "computer" refers to whatever game console it is emulating/being emulated on.

Something that a company makes that it usually doesn't approve of, is still that thing. If Disney somehow decided to make Mickey Mouse-brand condoms, would those not be condoms? All the defense needs to do is pull a "Websters Dictionary defines X as..." and they could likely prove that Virtual Console is an emulator. I do see your point though, and that is what Nintendo would likely argue if it came to that.

 

[Xzi]

They can't just be exploited with a paper clip, though tech-illiterate people might believe you.

That's the entry point, and all laymen need to know is that it grants full access to the system. Nintendo themselves "facilitate piracy" by relying on such paper-thin security measures.

Hopefully the legal fees will use up all the patreon money.

Hopefully Nintendo both loses the case and also must pay the defense's legal fees.

 

[Hassal]

They can't just be exploited with a paper clip, though tech-illiterate people might believe you.

Hopefully the legal fees will use up all the patreon money.


It's no different to decryption of dvd/bluray/live sports streams etc without permission.

The US courts seem to stand by the console market, but we'll see how it plays out. I'm surprised they haven't done this sooner, or treated them like GaryOPA.

Post automatically merged: Mar 1, 2024

Distributing the key is irrelevant, even telling people what algorithm the key needs to be used with to decrypt switch games is illegal.

There is an argument that yuzu thought they could get away with it because the information is widely available. I'm not going to guess how it will play out in court. Though of course the end result could by suing them out of existence, which wouldn't be a bad thing. Too much money and publicity in what they are doing.

You really are an N nerd are you?

There will absolutely be a case if the defendant shows up in the court room with a paper clip. Your average joe will not have the knowledge to use emulators, however, its very easy to use a dongle+paper clip. Heck, they just need to show up with a hard modded switch and the case would be closed instantly because even your granny can play a pirated copy.

 

[Sir Tortoise]

You really are an N nerd are you?

There will absolutely be a case if the defendant shows up in the court room with a paper clip. Your average joe will not have the knowledge to use emulators, however, its very easy to use a dongle+paper clip. Heck, they just need to show up with a hard modded switch and the case would be closed instantly because even your granny can play a pirated copy.

Sorry, I'm confused, what legal defence is a paperclip supposed to represent? I know it's funny and all but I wouldn't want to go to court with that as my defence.

 

[Metoroid0]

you have specific usage rights

he does actually.
its called owning the thing you bought.
just like companies own my previously hard earned money that they exchanged their products with me.
I dont tell them what should they do with the money i gave them.

 

[Hassal]

Sorry, I'm confused, what legal defence is a paperclip supposed to represent? I know it's funny and all but I wouldn't want to go to court with that as my defence.

Because they made the case that Yuzu was the main cause of piracy not the incompetency of their own ecosystem when their hardware itself can be hacked to play these.

If these ever succeed with their bullshittery, AMS will be their next target on the list because in their definition it facilitates piracy as well!

 

[Metoroid0]

Maybe Nintendo shouldn't be so leaky then.

I mean simple to understand analogy would be, if you have leaking pipe that sips water to the nighbor, you pay for damages (or water that they got in their apartmant, but in case of games its benefits not damages but same thing), you dont expect yor nighbours to pay for your poorly managed pipes.
fix your pipes nintendo! (and no i dont mean that video clip)

Post automatically merged: Mar 1, 2024

youve clearly not read the user agreements to anything youve bought

no, because transaction is simple at its core.
it should be so that even the dumbest person can understand.

you give you get, on both sides.

 

[Hassal]

Frankly, they will try to kill every project if you people let them have their way. All of you should be fully supportive for anything against this tyrant. I wouldn't give a flying fuck about yuzu to be quite honest but the implication of allowing these corporate obese men to shut down projects as they please will effect the entire emulation/homebrew community.

I'm 100% certain these clowns will kill AMS at some point which will mark the end of CFW working on future updates. Mark my word.

 

[ZeroT21]

Nintendo should sue anyone holding a paperclip

 

[Bladexdsl]

go on there X and say that.

FIx'd

 

[Revie]

That's the entry point, and all laymen need to know is that it grants full access to the system. Nintendo themselves "facilitate piracy" by relying on such paper-thin security measures.


Hopefully Nintendo both loses the case and also must pay the defense's legal fees.

Telling you that you're wrong for calling it "paper-thin security measures" from Nintendo would be an understatement.

It relies on a hardware vulnerability in the specific NVIDIA Tegra processor which was not discovered when Nintendo started manufacturing the console, and wasn't for a while after. In what world could that be thin security measures from Nintendo's side?

Just because all you have to do is short a pin, put in a USB and press a button on a GUI on your PC doesn't mean there isn't a lot to it.

---------

I'd say both parties have a case to win this lawsuit, probably favored for Yuzu / Tropic Haze LLC however the issue is that they might just go bankrupt/be forced to settle due to financial reasons because their pockets aren't nearly as deep as Nintendo's.

Wouldn't be surprised if this is a case where Nintendo really just wants to bully them until they don't have the funds to operate and/or fight back anymore.
Historically, most emulation lawsuits either are lost by the plaintiff but caused enough financial damage to the defendant for them to stop operating or get settled out of court.

 

[Sir Tortoise]

Because they made the case that Yuzu was the main cause of piracy not the incompetency of their own ecosystem when their hardware itself can be hacked to play these.

If these ever succeed with their bullshittery, AMS will be their next target on the list because in their definition it facilitates piracy as well!

Hmm, not sure "there are other ways to pirate besides Yuzu" would hold up as a defence.

 

[Revie]

Hmm, not sure "there are other ways to pirate besides Yuzu" would hold up as a defence.

Perhaps in a very hypothetical scenario where exploiting Switch's was due to a software exploit that they haven't patched for years, it could !
Though that's not the reality and the "other ways" rely on an NVIDIA Chip vulnerability or soldering non-Nintendo hardware, so not a chance haha

 

[kevin corms]

Piracy tends to lead to more sales, so even if there is piracy I dont see why they are doing this.

Post automatically merged: Mar 1, 2024

he does actually.
its called owning the thing you bought.
just like companies own my previously hard earned money that they exchanged their products with me.
I dont tell them what should they do with the money i gave them.

When you "buy" a game, you are buying a license. If you actually owned the game that would mean you could make copies, sell it, rent it out, sue other people for pirating it etc... You dont own any of your games, you own licenses.

 

[Hassal]

Hmm, not sure "there are other ways to pirate besides Yuzu" would hold up as a defence.

The point was they used Yuzu to repaint their own failure. Those 1 million downloads they pulled from their asses most definitely were not played on Yuzu but on their own failure hardware they continued to release. The game was NOT even playable on this emulator when it got leaked which adds to their BS.

 

[Xzi]

Telling you that you're wrong for calling it "paper-thin security measures" from Nintendo would be an understatement.

It relies on a hardware vulnerability in the specific NVIDIA Tegra processor which was not discovered when Nintendo started manufacturing the console, and wasn't for a while after. In what world could that be thin security measures from Nintendo's side?

So you're arguing in favor of incompetence in their QA department being the culprit now, that's not much better and still puts Nintendo on the back foot from a legal perspective. Moreover, if this was their first console to be exploited shortly after release, you could call it a coincidence and I'd probably agree with you. We all know that isn't the case, though. Nintendo intentionally goes cheap on the hardware side, and half-asses many aspects of their software relative to the competition. The courts aren't meant to be used as a pair of steel underwear to prevent Ninty's own bad decisions from coming back around to bite them in the ass.