If you care about the PSA only, scroll down to the last paragraph in the post.
Note: In the post I might mention Amazon as scAmazon ("scam Amazon"), and UPS as uUPS (pronounced as "oops").
Short backstory:
I've been trying to invest into mechanical keyboards, since I still haven't received any of my PS/2 to USB adapters, and my only USB keyboard has been damaged by a sandstorm blowing sand into my room and covering damn everything, including my only USB keyboard.
So, I have decided that I'll order everything from Amazon. It later turned out to be the worst posible idea.
The base keyboard was shipped with DHL, and it arrived in like... 3 business days, 5days before the earliest predicted timeframe.
However, the keys and my ST-LINK were shipped with UPS... oh no!
My experience with UPS:
It's important to know, that I have been forced to use UPS a few times before, and all of those times it was a painful experience, because they have always wasted my time and money, even back in 2015, and this current experience is sadly no exception...
Back in the past they always had some stupid reason they didn't deliver to us. They either always brougt it next door (which has the same address as us, except our address has a letter at the end), or they have wooshed past us without delivering my package and saying they couldn't deliver it, or they have parked 20min car drive away from us for 1-2weeks before I received my package.
The current one is so far their worst one, since they delivered it in 6days to the UPS center in Hungary (~1hr drive away from us, it's closer than my workplace was!), and it has been stuck there ever since, even at the time of writing this blog post, and it has been almost a damn month since it has been stuck there!
Dealing with UPS has caused me severe illnesses, including dizzyness, dry mouth, and very bad performance at my workplace.
They have the stupidest rules in place. They are uncoordinated, lazy, or straight up trolls. Oh, and don't even get me started on their stupid rule that the RECEIVER has no right to request a package search after it has been lost for so long!
Because Amazon shipped out my package, I had to contact Amazon to request a package search, since as I mentioned above, UPS only lets the sender request a package search. The problem with this is that Amazon employees are not allowed to bypass their internal automated carrier contact form. This is a problem, because due to how uncoordinated UPS is, the Hungarian division has STILL not received a package search request, even though it's been like a week since I requested a package search, and they said that the request MUST arrive within a working day.
My package has been in the same "parcel status not available, check back again later for scheduled delivery" status since a few weeks, and it still is as of writing this.
Amazon problem:
But in the end, this is all caused by Amazon themselves. I have collected a lot of info as to how and why this happens, and I want to share it with as many people as possible, because it's really imporant.
If you want an easily digestable summary of the below, scroll down to the PSA paragraph.
There are a lot of problems with Amazon, but I won't get into its monopolistic behavior, because frankly I don't really understand it all, because I don't understand finances or politics.
However, I can talk about its behavior which hurts both the seller and the buyer, but not Amazon, nor the carrier themselves.
Even though I have collected the below information from a small sample size, it has been repeated enough times to me by Amazon employees for me to believe that it's either true, or it's what Amazon wants you to think is true:
1) Amazon doesn't have an user-accessible carrier blacklist system.
I understand that most users aren't knowledgable or smart enough to understand how this works, but it shouldn't warrant a complete lack of functionality.
I also understand that Amazon partners with the carriers, most likely to make shipping prices slightly lower, and allowing the user to blacklist carriers would hurt this partnership, but not being able to blacklist carriers after repeated mishaps hurts both the buyer (because their packages will arrive late and/or damaged all the time, and it wastes their money AND TIME), and it ESPECIALLY hurts the seller. Read about why the seller is hurt a paragraph later.
2) Lack of transparency until you ask the question in a way a real or real-looking response can't be avoided
This is really bad. I had to ask the poor reps (who have been seemingly trained in a way to never make Amazon look bad until it's unavoidable) multiple times in a very specific way until they told the truth (or at least something looking like the truth).
Assuming what they say is true, here are the "lies" which are hidden from the buyer until you know how to explicitly ask the question in an unavoidable way:
- (Q) Does the refund come from the seller's pockets, or does it come from Amazon?
- (A) It comes from Amazon
- (Q) But is money taken out of the seller's account, or does the money come out of Amazon's pockets?
- (A) It comes from the seller's account, but it's provided by Amazon
This is really bad. I wanted to request a full refund for my items (yes, out of mallice, to hurt both Amazon for this bad automated system, and to hurt the carrier for being shitty), but it turns out that it's the exact damn opposite! The poor seller would've hurt, would have I not asked the question in a different way, and scAmazon and uUPS would not have been hurt in any way.
THIS IS HORRIBLE!
Imagine, how many people wanted to hurt scAmazon in the same way as I wanted to, but ended up unknowingly hurting the poor sellers instead! Even if you asked Amazon, they would tell you that the refund comes from Amazon! Even though that's not a lie, but you can lie by leaving out vital information, like seen from the conversation I actually had with multiple support reps.
- (Q) Can Amazon blacklist repeatedly misbehaving carriers for an account/address/region ?
- (A) No, we can't, due to the current world event
- (Q) And once the current world event were to end?
- (A) Then yes, we can temporarily blacklist and flag misbehaving carriers
This sadly doesn't say anything, after I have done my research. All evidence seems to lead to the fact that Amazon unblacklists carriers after a few weeks for the mishaps to continue all over again, unless that carrier is a nationwide repeat offender.
This is really bad, considering how I understand how Amazon's carrier system works, based on info I gathered from multiple support reps:
- Carriers can show themselves as "ready" in Amazon's system
- When you want to order something, Amazon's system asks each carrier for the selected shipping timeframe how much shipping would cost
- If the carrier says that it can do shipping in that timeframe for that price between two locations, always the cheapest method is selected instead of the fastest and most reliable
Considering that UPS will always be cheaper than DHL (which has never ever disappointed me and always bringed my items either on time, or before the predicted schedule), if I keep ordering from scAmazon, it's a very high chance that UPS will be automatically selected instead of DHL.
This means that I have to stop using Amazon if I want to avoid being ill and having my time and money wasted.
I'm at a loss on where else to order things from which is not eBay, not Amazon, and not AliExpress.
Oh, and on a closing note: when I close the support chat, it says that "Amazon is the world's most consumer-oriented company". This is not only hypocritical, but it's also a blatant lie, as demonstrated in the above paragraphs. Not only does the seller come last, and the consumer (the buyer) second-last, but they have repeatedly demonstrated that they secretly still only care about squeezing as much profit out as possible, while hurting both sellers and buyers alike, without holding themselves and their partners accountable for mistakes, unless there is a nationwide or worldwide outcry.
PSA:
- Don't request a full refund on Amazon, because it ONLY hurts the seller! Only request a full refund if the seller has scammed you. The best you can do if you don't want to hurt the seller is to ask for a shipping cost refund, since that should actually hurt Amazon and the carrier somewhat.
- Amazon's carrier selection system seems to be for-profit instead of pro-buyer, and chooses the carrier best for Amazon's wallet instead of the most reliable carrier for the given address/region/user.
- Amazon has no buyer-oriented blacklist system, and it's a lie if anyone says so otherwise. The blacklist system is only for Amazon themselves to temporarily mitigate outcry until everyone forgets about it, and to reduce any more potential income losses.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, especially if you work at Amazon and/or UPS and can answer if my view is right, skewed, or just wrong. Thank you
Note: In the post I might mention Amazon as scAmazon ("scam Amazon"), and UPS as uUPS (pronounced as "oops").
Short backstory:
I've been trying to invest into mechanical keyboards, since I still haven't received any of my PS/2 to USB adapters, and my only USB keyboard has been damaged by a sandstorm blowing sand into my room and covering damn everything, including my only USB keyboard.
So, I have decided that I'll order everything from Amazon. It later turned out to be the worst posible idea.
The base keyboard was shipped with DHL, and it arrived in like... 3 business days, 5days before the earliest predicted timeframe.
However, the keys and my ST-LINK were shipped with UPS... oh no!
My experience with UPS:
It's important to know, that I have been forced to use UPS a few times before, and all of those times it was a painful experience, because they have always wasted my time and money, even back in 2015, and this current experience is sadly no exception...
Back in the past they always had some stupid reason they didn't deliver to us. They either always brougt it next door (which has the same address as us, except our address has a letter at the end), or they have wooshed past us without delivering my package and saying they couldn't deliver it, or they have parked 20min car drive away from us for 1-2weeks before I received my package.
The current one is so far their worst one, since they delivered it in 6days to the UPS center in Hungary (~1hr drive away from us, it's closer than my workplace was!), and it has been stuck there ever since, even at the time of writing this blog post, and it has been almost a damn month since it has been stuck there!
Dealing with UPS has caused me severe illnesses, including dizzyness, dry mouth, and very bad performance at my workplace.
They have the stupidest rules in place. They are uncoordinated, lazy, or straight up trolls. Oh, and don't even get me started on their stupid rule that the RECEIVER has no right to request a package search after it has been lost for so long!
Because Amazon shipped out my package, I had to contact Amazon to request a package search, since as I mentioned above, UPS only lets the sender request a package search. The problem with this is that Amazon employees are not allowed to bypass their internal automated carrier contact form. This is a problem, because due to how uncoordinated UPS is, the Hungarian division has STILL not received a package search request, even though it's been like a week since I requested a package search, and they said that the request MUST arrive within a working day.
My package has been in the same "parcel status not available, check back again later for scheduled delivery" status since a few weeks, and it still is as of writing this.
Amazon problem:
But in the end, this is all caused by Amazon themselves. I have collected a lot of info as to how and why this happens, and I want to share it with as many people as possible, because it's really imporant.
If you want an easily digestable summary of the below, scroll down to the PSA paragraph.
There are a lot of problems with Amazon, but I won't get into its monopolistic behavior, because frankly I don't really understand it all, because I don't understand finances or politics.
However, I can talk about its behavior which hurts both the seller and the buyer, but not Amazon, nor the carrier themselves.
Even though I have collected the below information from a small sample size, it has been repeated enough times to me by Amazon employees for me to believe that it's either true, or it's what Amazon wants you to think is true:
1) Amazon doesn't have an user-accessible carrier blacklist system.
I understand that most users aren't knowledgable or smart enough to understand how this works, but it shouldn't warrant a complete lack of functionality.
I also understand that Amazon partners with the carriers, most likely to make shipping prices slightly lower, and allowing the user to blacklist carriers would hurt this partnership, but not being able to blacklist carriers after repeated mishaps hurts both the buyer (because their packages will arrive late and/or damaged all the time, and it wastes their money AND TIME), and it ESPECIALLY hurts the seller. Read about why the seller is hurt a paragraph later.
2) Lack of transparency until you ask the question in a way a real or real-looking response can't be avoided
This is really bad. I had to ask the poor reps (who have been seemingly trained in a way to never make Amazon look bad until it's unavoidable) multiple times in a very specific way until they told the truth (or at least something looking like the truth).
Assuming what they say is true, here are the "lies" which are hidden from the buyer until you know how to explicitly ask the question in an unavoidable way:
- (Q) Does the refund come from the seller's pockets, or does it come from Amazon?
- (A) It comes from Amazon
- (Q) But is money taken out of the seller's account, or does the money come out of Amazon's pockets?
- (A) It comes from the seller's account, but it's provided by Amazon
This is really bad. I wanted to request a full refund for my items (yes, out of mallice, to hurt both Amazon for this bad automated system, and to hurt the carrier for being shitty), but it turns out that it's the exact damn opposite! The poor seller would've hurt, would have I not asked the question in a different way, and scAmazon and uUPS would not have been hurt in any way.
THIS IS HORRIBLE!
Imagine, how many people wanted to hurt scAmazon in the same way as I wanted to, but ended up unknowingly hurting the poor sellers instead! Even if you asked Amazon, they would tell you that the refund comes from Amazon! Even though that's not a lie, but you can lie by leaving out vital information, like seen from the conversation I actually had with multiple support reps.
- (Q) Can Amazon blacklist repeatedly misbehaving carriers for an account/address/region ?
- (A) No, we can't, due to the current world event
- (Q) And once the current world event were to end?
- (A) Then yes, we can temporarily blacklist and flag misbehaving carriers
This sadly doesn't say anything, after I have done my research. All evidence seems to lead to the fact that Amazon unblacklists carriers after a few weeks for the mishaps to continue all over again, unless that carrier is a nationwide repeat offender.
This is really bad, considering how I understand how Amazon's carrier system works, based on info I gathered from multiple support reps:
- Carriers can show themselves as "ready" in Amazon's system
- When you want to order something, Amazon's system asks each carrier for the selected shipping timeframe how much shipping would cost
- If the carrier says that it can do shipping in that timeframe for that price between two locations, always the cheapest method is selected instead of the fastest and most reliable
Considering that UPS will always be cheaper than DHL (which has never ever disappointed me and always bringed my items either on time, or before the predicted schedule), if I keep ordering from scAmazon, it's a very high chance that UPS will be automatically selected instead of DHL.
This means that I have to stop using Amazon if I want to avoid being ill and having my time and money wasted.
I'm at a loss on where else to order things from which is not eBay, not Amazon, and not AliExpress.
Oh, and on a closing note: when I close the support chat, it says that "Amazon is the world's most consumer-oriented company". This is not only hypocritical, but it's also a blatant lie, as demonstrated in the above paragraphs. Not only does the seller come last, and the consumer (the buyer) second-last, but they have repeatedly demonstrated that they secretly still only care about squeezing as much profit out as possible, while hurting both sellers and buyers alike, without holding themselves and their partners accountable for mistakes, unless there is a nationwide or worldwide outcry.
PSA:
- Don't request a full refund on Amazon, because it ONLY hurts the seller! Only request a full refund if the seller has scammed you. The best you can do if you don't want to hurt the seller is to ask for a shipping cost refund, since that should actually hurt Amazon and the carrier somewhat.
- Amazon's carrier selection system seems to be for-profit instead of pro-buyer, and chooses the carrier best for Amazon's wallet instead of the most reliable carrier for the given address/region/user.
- Amazon has no buyer-oriented blacklist system, and it's a lie if anyone says so otherwise. The blacklist system is only for Amazon themselves to temporarily mitigate outcry until everyone forgets about it, and to reduce any more potential income losses.
Please correct me if I'm wrong, especially if you work at Amazon and/or UPS and can answer if my view is right, skewed, or just wrong. Thank you
