Hall Joysticks On Switch Pro Controller

[NeoHoth]

These new modules from Gulikit have been popping up on Aliexpress recently.

Bad news, these also have additional components on the board. But the IC looks different from other modules.

Here's to hoping self-contained sticks for a straightforward swap still become available.

Ignore this model all the way. It would be hard to make it compatible with 3-pin per axis connection of traditional controller boards, such as Switch Pro Controller and Xbox motherboards, etc.

Getting my self-contained joysticks pretty soon to give you further updates on this project.

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

Bad news everyone
I just got the sticks and drift compensators, and it does not work, it has the same problem as the K-Silver sticks on joycons,
they are off centered and you cannot calibrate it, the drift compensator board also doesn't work as a way to center the sticks and calibrate them properly.

I'll make a video and post here

Would you be so kind as to share a video with the community so to see it in action as well as how you got it installed on the Pro Controller board?

 

[victorstk]

Ignore this model all the way. It would be hard to make it compatible with 3-pin per axis connection of traditional controller boards, such as Switch Pro Controller and Xbox motherboards, etc.

Getting my self-contained joysticks pretty soon to give you further updates on this project.

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

Would you be so kind as to share a video with the community so to see it in action as well as how you got it installed on the Pro Controller board?

I have recorded the installation and testing process

I just havent edited the video yet

I'll post it here soon

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

Update:
Actually the store that I bought my sticks is different
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004957224138.html

thought the picture is the same, the model I received have those extra chips
I asked for a refund on aliexpress, hopefully @NeoHoth model won't need the extra chips and will work properly

though I'm not sure if that is really the issue, the sticks are exactly the same, so why some have this extra chip and buttons?

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

@NeoHoth here is the video
(no voice over and not finalized yet but enough to satisfy your curiosity)

 

[NeoHoth]

I have recorded the installation and testing process

I just havent edited the video yet

I'll post it here soon

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

Update:
Actually the store that I bought my sticks is different
https://www.aliexpress.com/item/1005004957224138.html

thought the picture is the same, the model I received have those extra chips
I asked for a refund on aliexpress, hopefully @NeoHoth model won't need the extra chips and will work properly

though I'm not sure if that is really the issue, the sticks are exactly the same, so why some have this extra chip and buttons?

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

@NeoHoth here is the video
(no voice over and not finalized yet but enough to satisfy your curiosity)

Wow! @victorstk, thank you for the video and looking forward to the voice-over! That was a quick response full of resourceful info!

It is not out of unusual seeing that the right stick had better success in calibration, as it is all about quality of magnets, their structure, components and magnetic force equality of each magnet that effects the magnetic field and data readings.

Seeing each stick off-centered out of the box on the video comfirms different precision standards of each magnet installed per each axis of these sticks. I just wonder how mine "self-contained" joysticks would work on Steam Deck...

Nevertheless, it has dawned on me that I will be inevitably facing the same issue as yours, @victorstk, disregarding whether the joysticks would come with or without a chip and based on the concept and analysis expelled above and below:

---

Having experienced installation and callibration process of GuliKit Joystick Replacements for Steam Deck, and based on the instruction, the calibration is made as such:

The stick has be to be tilted to the opposite side of the drift and the "Set" button on the back side of the daughter board has to be pressed to center the stick evenly by X and Y axis, i.e. first - tilt to the oposite side of the drift tilting it to the same opposed value and then - press "Set" to calibrate the center position.

It is self-explanatory as for the requirement to tilt the thumbstick to the opposite side of the drift of the same opposed value, as the values will be then added or substracted from the raw uncalibrated center position values, which will result in proper calibrated center position.

I guess this is what this SPI chip and "set" button is required for - to achieve hardware callibration without requiring software calibration of the Steam Deck itself that is still accessible if you need so.

---

Other thing that has come to my mind is that this SPI chip and tilting the stick to the opposite side and then "setting" centered position callibration procedure is exactly what @victorstk has attempted to do with the magnet - influence the magnetic field by analog method.

Simply put, the SPI chip does it on a digital raw-data level by adding or retracting opposed values from raw data of X and Y axis to make them act as reference for center position of the joystick. That seems to be doable with the callibration software of the Steam Deck and in Steam Deck's scenario, if the joysticks come without SPI chip installed, such as mines, then the Steam Deck will be the only device responsible for the reference values and callibration, but, being thankful for this previous experience, it is Nintendo Switch and Nintendo Pro Controller we are curious about in this particular thread and project.

In our case all the reference data and callibration is hardcoded into the SPI chip on the motherboard of the Pro Controller, and we have a possibility to overwrite those reference values with the Switch calibration software. Sure, we cannot see numeric/hex values in there, nor can we make any value input by ourselves other than just tilting the thumbstick on the request of the software, but we shall never forget about the wonderful external software known as Joy-Con Toolkit.

Joy-Con Toolkit has to be explored in greater detail when it comes to callibration and overwriting user-callibrated values. I am certain that this is where the solution to our issue is buried.

 

[victorstk]

Wow! @victorstk, thank you for the video and looking forward to the voice-over! That was a quick response full of resourceful info!

It is not out of unusual seeing that the right stick had better success in calibration, as it is all about quality of magnets, their structure, components and magnetic force equality of each magnet that effects the magnetic field and data readings.

Seeing each stick off-centered out of the box on the video comfirms different precision standards of each magnet installed per each axis of these sticks. I just wonder how mine "self-contained" joysticks would work on Steam Deck...

Nevertheless, it has dawned on me that I will be inevitably facing the same issue as yours, @victorstk, disregarding whether the joysticks would come with or without a chip and based on the concept and analysis expelled above and below:

---

Having experienced installation and callibration process of GuliKit Joystick Replacements for Steam Deck, and based on the instruction, the calibration is made as such:

The stick has be to be tilted to the opposite side of the drift and the "Set" button on the back side of the daughter board has to be pressed to center the stick evenly by X and Y axis, i.e. first - tilt to the oposite side of the drift tilting it to the same opposed value and then - press "Set" to calibrate the center position.

It is self-explanatory as for the requirement to tilt the thumbstick to the opposite side of the drift of the same opposed value, as the values will be then added or substracted from the raw uncalibrated center position values, which will result in proper calibrated center position.

I guess this is what this SPI chip and "set" button is required for - to achieve hardware callibration without requiring software calibration of the Steam Deck itself that is still accessible if you need so.

---

Other thing that has come to my mind is that this SPI chip and tilting the stick to the opposite side and then "setting" centered position callibration procedure is exactly what @victorstk has attempted to do with the magnet - influence the magnetic field by analog method.

Simply put, the SPI chip does it on a digital raw-data level by adding or retracting opposed values from raw data of X and Y axis to make them act as reference for center position of the joystick. That seems to be doable with the callibration software of the Steam Deck and in Steam Deck's scenario, if the joysticks come without SPI chip installed, such as mines, then the Steam Deck will be the only device responsible for the reference values and callibration, but, being thankful for this previous experience, it is Nintendo Switch and Nintendo Pro Controller we are curious about in this particular thread and project.

In our case all the reference data and callibration is hardcoded into the SPI chip on the motherboard of the Pro Controller, and we have a possibility to overwrite those reference values with the Switch calibration software. Sure, we cannot see numeric/hex values in there, nor can we make any value input by ourselves other than just tilting the thumbstick on the request of the software, but we shall never forget about the wonderful external software known as Joy-Con Toolkit.

Joy-Con Toolkit has to be explored in greater detail when it comes to callibration and overwriting user-callibrated values. I am certain that this is where the solution to our issue is buried.

Yes I was thinking the sams about the joycon toolkit

I will later reinstall these sticks and attempt to calibrate them with the joycon toolkit to see if they will work

 

[NeoHoth]

Here is an interesting video and proof of concept about GuliKit Steam Deck Joystick Replacements installed on PS4 controller.

It may become available as an open-source project thanks to Marius Heier promises. This is what @Retro2Modern was curious about and maybe you can both collaborate on this project.

We should really get down to Joy-Con Toolkit to see if we can get without the voltage adjustment chip and just play with raw data. Otherwise, we will have to reverse engineer the daughterboard mechanism and components to fit Pro Controller's shell (maybe the back side of the Pro Controller motherboard can easily accommodate everything what is required? This is what will have to determine if Joy-Con Toolkit will not be enough)

@victorstk, would you be so kind as to send us a full-range picture of K-Silver replacement daughterboards with clear image of contact and traces from the front and back side?
I will definitely share mine once I receive my hall joysticks.

Post automatically merged: Feb 12, 2023

It is still pretty surprising to see that there were no hiccups after installation of K-Silver Hall Effect Joysticks on PS5 motherboard as shown in this BiliBill video.

 

[Retro2Modern]

Here is an interesting video and proof of concept about GuliKit Steam Deck Joystick Replacements installed on PS4 controller.

It may become available as an open-source project thanks to Marius Heier promises. This is what @Retro2Modern was curious about and maybe you can both collaborate on this project.

We should really get down to Joy-Con Toolkit to see if we can get without the voltage adjustment chip and just play with raw data. Otherwise, we will have to reverse engineer the daughterboard mechanism and components to fit Pro Controller's shell (maybe the back side of the Pro Controller motherboard can easily accommodate everything what is required? This is what will have to determine if Joy-Con Toolkit will not be enough)

@victorstk, would you be so kind as to send us a full-range picture of K-Silver replacement daughterboards with clear image of contact and traces from the front and back side?
I will definitely share mine once I receive my hall joysticks.

Post automatically merged: Feb 12, 2023

It is still pretty surprising to see that there were no hiccups after installation of K-Silver Hall Effect Joysticks on PS5 motherboard as shown in this BiliBill video.

Thanks for the mention about this. I also checked out the video, and Marius Heier actually had a good idea to make a custom hall effect stick for the current Alps ones. I should've thought about something like this long ago with a custom PCB to fit into a custom pot housing with a round ring magnet instead yet was having trouble with it on an old Xbox One Controller I used to have long ago.

 

[Retro2Modern]

I might still try the K-Silver modules for one of my Switch Pro Controllers (not the one that I had to revamp from a Smash Ultimate theme to a European/Japanese Super NES theme), but if anything comes up, I might try Heier's kits since he is planning on selling a pair per axis for $20-$30 of course.

 

[NeoHoth]

I might still try the K-Silver modules for one of my Switch Pro Controllers (not the one that I had to revamp from a Smash Ultimate theme to a European/Japanese Super NES theme), but if anything comes up, I might try Heier's kits since he is planning on selling a pair per axis for $20-$30 of course.

Here is link 1 & link 2 to follow Marius Heier's store and availability of custom hall sensing joysticks.

 

[victorstk]

Here is link 1 & link 2 to follow Marius Heier's store and availability of custom hall sensing joysticks.

@NeoHoth have you received your sticks?

 

[NeoHoth]

@NeoHoth have you received your sticks?

Thanks for asking. I am still waiting. Forecasted ETA is 25.02.2023. Looking forward to get them installed on Pro Controller ASAP.

As for the voltage adjustment and SPI chips those are found on daughterboards, I think it is possible to bypass voltage adjustment chip to get Pro Controller outputting proper x & y values.

---
First of all, once you get your hall effect joystics, it is a known fact that you are not going to have all magnets pre-installed with equal magnetic force. This is what a Voltage Control chip, SPI and DAC are for, found on each Steam Deck Hall Effect Joystick daughterboard (L & R).

K-Silver's and Gulikit's approach in regards to Steam Deck Hall Joystick replacement calibration is the same - they rely on calibration values written on both SPI Flash (correct me, if I am wrong), as you cannot make a dependancy on a single SPI, since joysticks are soldered on different daughterboards and are apart from each other. It is a measure of hassle-free performance so to have your joysticks always working the same once you have calibrated them no matter what happens to your Steam device.

Taking into account my previous analysis of raw values and max, 0, min reference points for each axis, we may proceed further with my current analysis.

The SPI found on the original Steam Deck joystick boards seems to be capable of communicating, and calibration values can be adjusted and then injected to SPI flash with the built-in calibration software of Steam Deck itself. This explains why we get buttons on the aftermarket joystick replacement boards, as they are used for calibration control independently from Steam Deck, as well as it is required to retrofit hall effect sensing joysticks on the potentiometer-controlled device by design.

On the side note, eventhough hall effect is resembling the potentiometer-based joystick approach through referencing certain voltage to x & y min;0;max points, there is a calibration script available on Steam Deck desktop mode that would calibrate joysticks referencing just raw values, but these parameters will only be recorded onto and recognized by the particular Steam Deck you have run this script on. And once you would require to reinstall the OS, or hop from Steam OS to Win, you are going to have tough time recalibrating them after each OS reinstallation.

Nevertheless, the existance of this script that binds raw values, other than voltage, to reference points of each axis really gives me high hopes on Joy-Con Toolkit as we can try without voltage control chip. Same is approached through Switch Calibration built-in software, but it was designed to calibrate already factory pre-calibrated potentiometer-based joysticks and it does not allow you to reference raw values to axis points, if raw value is outside the range Nintendo has put the limit for, assuming it is a potentiometer-based joystick you are calibrating.

In mass production, DAC, voltage controller chip and SPI Flash is required so to pre-program controllers/joystick daughterboards at the factory and have them plug-and-play ready waiting on the shelf. In our case with Switch Pro Controller, if we are bypassing voltage control chip, we may perform an individual calibration according to raw values those are being output by the DAC without voltage adjustment chip solely relying on the individuality of magnetic field. These values can be referenced to -1;0;1 of x & y axis.

If we would take Gulikit King Kong Pro 2 or 8Bitdo Ultimate Bluetooth Controller for a comparison to Switch Pro controller, all of them have single SPI, which is responsible for values of both joysticks. Calibration is done either in software in case of 8Bitdo or independently by launching a calibration process with combination of pressed buttons in Gulikit's case.

As for the Switch Pro Controller, the same may be attempted with Joy-Con Toolkit.

 

[victorstk]

I asked for a refund on aliexpress and they accepted since the product I received is different from the pictures of the store

I will still wait for your sticks before attempting to open my controller again and do more experiments

 

[Retro2Modern]

I just received my electromagnetic joysticks today, but IDK if I should attempt to try and do a stick replacement though. If I do, I might try calibrating them with the Joy Con Toolkit of course.

 

[NeoHoth]

I just received my electromagnetic joysticks today, but IDK if I should attempt to try and do a stick replacement though. If I do, I might try calibrating them with the Joy Con Toolkit of course.

I am still expecting mine in 2 days...my local post is working at a turtle's pace...

@Retro2Modern, do you have a chip installed on daughterboards of your joysticks?

 

[Retro2Modern]

I am still expecting mine in 2 days...my local post is working at a turtle's pace...

@Retro2Modern, do you have a chip installed on daughterboards of your joysticks?

Yes.

 

[Smoker1]

 

[Retro2Modern]

@NeoHoth I was able to find one of the chips I had from ONE of the daughterboards from the aftermarket modules with the pot-look-alike-hall-effect-rockers. I couldn't salvage the other one since it was still attached to the other module. Is THIS chip the one that is the DAC microcontroller? If so, then IDK, somebody needs to actually create a DAC from an ATTiny85 microcontroller chip instead of having to use one with too many pins unless we know how to get these working while soldered to the rockers or parts of the Pro Controller board with the correct solder points.

EDIT: I was able to salvage the second chip from the second daughterboard by getting it out of my garbage can (mostly due to myself being a dummy tossing it in there without knowing about the chips).

 

[NeoHoth]

@NeoHoth I was able to find one of the chips I had from ONE of the daughterboards from the aftermarket modules with the pot-look-alike-hall-effect-rockers. I couldn't salvage the other one since it was still attached to the other module. Is THIS chip the one that is the DAC microcontroller? If so, then IDK, somebody needs to actually create a DAC from an ATTiny85 microcontroller chip instead of having to use one with too many pins unless we know how to get these working while soldered to the rockers or parts of the Pro Controller board with the correct solder points.

EDIT: I was able to salvage the second chip from the second daughterboard by getting it out of my garbage can (mostly due to myself being a dummy tossing it in there without knowing about the chips).

I guess this is a DAC chip (with SPI Flash and Voltage Controller Combined) that is actually adjusting for hall sensors those are soldered to those 3-pin connections per axis.

I am an amateur in the field of microcontroller electronics, so it is better to ask or wait for an expert's viewpoint.

 

[Retro2Modern]

I guess this is a DAC chip (with SPI Flash and Voltage Controller Combined) that is actually adjusting for hall sensors those are soldered to those 3-pin connections per axis.

I am an amateur in the field of microcontroller electronics, so it is better to ask or wait for an expert's viewpoint.

I'll ask him about these chips and whether they can be soldered to any kind of controller of course.

EDIT: I looked up the model number of the chip and it's an MC32F7361A0K-21828-27 (look up MC32F7361on Google) microcontroller chip so these might have a DAC built into them. Now we need to know whether it can be possible to solder these chips onto a DIY breadboard, or use some precision micro-soldering for each pin to use for both the X and Y axes of both sticks.

EDIT 2: If it would be possible to reverse engineer these kinds of chips for open-sourcing for all game controllers to use either some hall effect rockers or any hall effect sensor and a magnet with any MCU like an ATtiny85, it just might work well.

 

[victorstk]

@NeoHoth any update on your package?

 

[NeoHoth]

@NeoHoth any update on your package?

Sadly, I was given a fake number promising to arrive by 25.02.2023...
The new tracking number states that the package is still on the way