Spanking/Belting... Child Abuse or not?

[MasterM]

If you speak to them and tell them no or whatever, and you raise your voice and what not, and they're still being little shits, what else can you do?
It means u failed parenthood.
Teaching responsibility revolves around principle of reward and punishment (it doesnt have to be physical and definitely shouldnt be one).

QUOTE(Ace Faith @ Dec 8 2010, 05:19 PM) It saddens me A LOT to see Swedish parents completely failing at communicating their parental control, even at a casual level with them.

Thats the key issue im writing about.

I have to admit its very wise for a 15 year old to understand it.

 

[Goli]

I'm curious, to the people who say "THERE ARE INFINITELY BETTER WAYS" than to spank a child, list them.

If you speak to them and tell them no or whatever, and you raise your voice and what not, and they're still being little shits, what else can you do? If you don't keep the child in line, they're going to just walk all over you because there's no punishment.

"Oh my parents said not to, oh well, what are they gonna do."

But still, list what these infinitely better ways are.

Yes but violence isn't the only punishment. You can take away the kids toys or whatever he really likes such as the computer, consoles, etc. You can ignore the kid too, ignore not as in let him starve to death obviously, ignore as in just continue as if nothing was happening, eventually kids get tired. There are plenty of other ways I probably can't think of right now.
The other problem I find with spanking and all that is that when parents do it, many kids perceive that as something "normal", then when they're in school or in some other activity which involves interactions with others they resort to violence too. Many "bullies" bully other kids because they're spanked, hit and who knows what else, so they think it's fine for them to do the same. And then when they grow up they hit their wives and kids too, it's a big vicious circle.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

It means u failed parenthood.

Not it doesn't. If the kid isn't listening to you, that doesn't mean you failed parenthood. Jeez, what kind of parent are you?

 

[Waynes1987]

It means u failed parenthood.

Not it doesn't. If the kid isn't listening to you, that doesn't mean you failed parenthood. Jeez, what kind of parent are you?

If your kid isnt listening to you it means you failed at teaching them respect.
And were talking no listening at all here. Because kids rebel against there parents its all part of growning up.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

Fuck dude, like 95% of kids don't listen to their parents, you telling me 95% failed parenthood? Hell I'm sure there's something that poster has problem with his kids, I could easily say he failed parenthood because of it.

Also, I never listened to my parents as a child. I didn't listen to anybody. I got yelled at a lot, it wasn't until I started... you know what, not even going to try here, clearly talking to someone who thinks spanking someone is abuse.

 

[emigre]

I wouldn't go as far to say its child abuse, but it isn't the type of parenting I would want to engage in if I were to become a parent. I was actually never hit as a child as punishment and actually had quite a upbringing where I enjoyed almost limitless liberty. I should add my parents aren't educated middle-class liberal lefties but Bangladeshi immigrants, who don't have a single formal qualification between them. And apart from a crippling problem of self-doubt, I've turned out ok-ish. I'm in higher education and I've never been in trouble with the authorities.

With hitting a child as punishment, I have to say it seems the parenting of failure. It is possible to raise a child well without resorting to that. I know some people reading this would dismiss my view as liberal nonsense but I see no correlation between smacking and the result of the child into adulthood. I have two older sisters and the older was the only one of us to have been hit as a child. And for her is has casued long term damage, as a child, our mum used to hit her for not eating her lunch. And becasue she didn't want to be hit, she would eat her lunch. When she older she found out, our mohter would give her lunch less than two hours after she sould eat something at nursary. And she's had a problem with flucturating weight. And hence I would associate hitting with bad parenting.

I would also say hitting doesn't aid a child in knowing good or bad but good communication and how much time you spend with the child. My mother is a horrible communicater and has never spent any quality time with me. Throughout my life, I've never had a good relationship with her. She thinks I'm stupid and quite ashamed of me. My father on the other hand would spend time with me, I remember him taking me to the park to play football numerous times. I get along much better with him and he thinks higher of me. In adulthood, I'm much more appreciative of dad despite I would only see two hours a day due to his job as chef where my mohter was a homemaker. My sister has two young children and they clearly think more of my dad than my mother. Though I wouldn't go as far to say I hat my mother, I do hold feelings of resent towards her. I know she loves me but she knows very little of me, to go as far as her not knowing what I'm studying at University.

With parenting its much more complicated than what it may appear to be. I'm no parent but I am an uncle and I've found working on having a relationship with the child tends to be fruitfull. I have a niece and nephew and get along brilliantly with both of them, yes they get on my nerves but I want the best for them. Hence for me, making sure I have good relationship with them where I can communicate with them is more beneficial for their upbringing.

 

[ThePowerOutage]

As long as is called for, it's not done as a spur of the moment thing and it's explained why its happened, im fine with it. If those things don't happen then that's when other stuff happens.
Hey, the idea of inflicting pain to teach a lesson comes from nature. (I.e Stay the hell away from wasps)
It certainly help drill in a message.
Though another thing, I think it should be done in private unless the Kid is really acting up, like say, tripping up old ladies in Asda.
As long as it isn't abused, then it isn't abuse.
Tis comes from someone still on th recording end.

 

[_Chaz_]

If a child is out of line, sometimes it's the only way.

Eventually they learn that verbal warnings aren't shit.

 

[MelodieOctavia]

Fuck dude, like 95% of kids don't listen to their parents, you telling me 95% failed parenthood? Hell I'm sure there's something that poster has problem with his kids, I could easily say he failed parenthood because of it.

Also, I never listened to my parents as a child. I didn't listen to anybody. I got yelled at a lot, it wasn't until I started... you know what, not even going to try here, clearly talking to someone who thinks spanking someone is abuse.

yeah because 95% is a totally legit statistic.

Ignoring that, what you and most people fail to realize is that fear does not equal respect. In fact Most of the time when there is extensive fear through beating a child, all the respect is gone, thus children acting up because they don't respect their parents, thus more beatings, and so the vicious cycle goes.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

mum used to hit her for not eating her lunch. And becasue she didn't want to be hit, she would eat her lunch.

Oh I don't mean things like that, even that seems a bit bad to me [different cultures obviously view differently], but I mean like throwing rocks, making a sibling cry because you hit them, ruining other people's property, throwing a fit and making a mess in the house at the same time your pissed off...

 

[Evo.lve]

Personally I don't think it's child abuse, but they have to deserve it.

E.g. If I'm playing the piano, and I play a single note wrong, my dad will go spastic and 99% of the time hit me.

 

[Slyakin]

Well, I get belted. Not too much, though.


I was strangled about 2 years ago, and after that, my dad sort of just resorted to plain belt. Also, punching me in the chest. And kicking me on the ground (once, thankfully).


I find it child abuse that he beats me like that, but groundings/MAYBE beatings can be necessary. It depends on the situation.

Is your child just being annoying? Don't beat him, just ground the kid if needed.

Did you child do something a lot worse? Then yes, beatings are fine.

 

[ShadowSoldier]

Personally I don't think it's child abuse, but they have to deserve it.

E.g. If I'm playing the piano, and I play a single note wrong, my dad will go spastic and 99% of the time hit me.

So your dad was a prick.


QUOTEIgnoring that, what you and most people fail to realize is that fear does not equal respect.

Not everybody fears their parents though. I got spanked a lot, and I also got hit with the belt more, and harder. Do I fear my parents? Not one bit.

Also not everybody who was spanked, doesn't respect their parents.

 

[Slyakin]

Not everybody fears their parents though. I got spanked a lot, and I also got hit with the belt more, and harder. Do I fear my parents? Not one bit.

Also not everybody who was spanked, doesn't respect their parents.

Yeah, I respect my mom.

My dad? Well...

 

[ShadowSoldier]

Wait, I realized I just used the wrong wording, can you tell I'm tired?

I meant to say:

"There are a lot of kids in the world who weren't spanked as a child, and they don't respect their parents."

 

[Pyrmon]

I was a good kid and I never got spanked, but my prick of a father was(and still is) using psychological violence. And he did abuse my older siblings before so it scared the shit out of me when he yelled. And he yelled a lot for no reason. He used to scream and yell and call us names for stupid little mistakes we did. He also threatened to break things that were dear to me, several times. He doesn't do that as much now, but he still is. Let me say, I would have much preferred a little spanking and a discussion afterwards during the first 7 or 8 years of my life than to live in fear that he'll start yelling and throwing stuff until I move out.

Abuse is very serious and leaves scars for a long time. Even I have anger management issues because of my father. Spanking is really not abuse, belting either.

 

[ThatDudeWithTheFood]

I don't think its abuse but I definitely don't support it belts hurt like crap!

 

[ineap09]

Fuck dude, like 95% of kids don't listen to their parents, you telling me 95% failed parenthood? Hell I'm sure there's something that poster has problem with his kids, I could easily say he failed parenthood because of it.

Also, I never listened to my parents as a child. I didn't listen to anybody. I got yelled at a lot, it wasn't until I started... you know what, not even going to try here, clearly talking to someone who thinks spanking someone is abuse.

yeah because 95% is a totally legit statistic.

Ignoring that, what you and most people fail to realize is that fear does not equal respect. In fact Most of the time when there is extensive fear through beating a child, all the respect is gone, thus children acting up because they don't respect their parents, thus more beatings, and so the vicious cycle goes.

You're right, fear does not equal respect. But you respect your parents for loving you enough to make you fear the consequences of doing wrong so you don't hurt yourself or others.

Plus, children shouldn't fear their parents, they should just fear the consequence of doing wrong. As long as the parent isn't abusively beating the child without reason, the child shouldn't fear the parent just because they are the bringers of justice...right?

 

[Goli]

Fuck dude, like 95% of kids don't listen to their parents, you telling me 95% failed parenthood? Hell I'm sure there's something that poster has problem with his kids, I could easily say he failed parenthood because of it.

Also, I never listened to my parents as a child. I didn't listen to anybody. I got yelled at a lot, it wasn't until I started... you know what, not even going to try here, clearly talking to someone who thinks spanking someone is abuse.
Until I started cutting you mean. Cutting isn't something healthy, maybe you resort to it because you were abused as a child.

QUOTE(ShadowSoldier @ Dec 8 2010, 08:03 PM) Wait, I realized I just used the wrong wording, can you tell I'm tired?

I meant to say:

"There are a lot of kids in the world who weren't spanked as a child, and they don't respect their parents."

There are a lot of kids in the world who weren't spanked as a child, and they do respect their parents.
Like I said on my previous post, it just creates a vicious circle. Since nobody replied to it I'll just assume "silence is assent" as they say.

 

[nutella]

If you're going to hit a child, then I would say use it not as a punishment but as a way of establishing authority. As long as you're not causing any physical injury to the child, it's okay in my book. Thing is, kids are taught that everything is child abuse these days so a lot of them are rebelling against their parents. It's a hard issue to debate, because every child is different.