Stereotypical opinions of muslims

[ThatDudeWithTheFood]

The only muslim terrorist I know are Al-Qaeda members. And at this time, we don't even know if they exist. The only thing we know is that whenever there's some terrorist act, someone (we don't know who it is) says that was Al-Qaeda, without verification. When you compare this to real organized groups like ETA, that's just some bulls**t. In fact, Al-Qaeda could be some anons on the internetz, that would be the same thing.

There are more terrorist organisations than that run by Muslims. If you want to watch something interesting watch My Trip To Al-Qaeda.

I know that there are certainly a lot more terrorist organisations, but the thing I wanted to point out is that most of the people thinks that they some kind of super international organisations, and in fact, most of them are only a bunch of crazy guys. In France, they're talking about Al-Qaeda Mahgreb, just like if it was an international compagny... I admit that it's strange that they're all muslims, But why ? Is it really because of the religion ? Or is it because those people are totally screwed ? Or maybe they live in a really hard situation and people are just abusing them ? I really want to understand.

Personally, I think it's because islam is a pretty "old-school" religion, and some of the rules are not adapted to our time. A second element would be that there are too much interpretations of the Quran, so it's easy to brainwash weak people or simply interpret the writing as we wish. So for me the real problem is more the people than the religion itself.

It really isn't old school since most people live normally.

All those rules in the Qu'ran they're in the bible.

Terrorists just exploit the Qu'ran to recruit "true" muslims.

 

[Ritsuki]

When I say old school, it's only because the rules didn't change since the beginning. It doesn't mean that people have to live like 1000 years ago to be true muslims

Christianism is less old-school because there's the New Testament, some kind of "general add-on" to the old one. We don't have a thing like that in islam. By example, the islam in Morocco is not the same than the one in Albania.

We should not forget that the only difference between the 3 monotheist religions are only some differences of opinions : some people thought that Jesus was the son of God, some others did not agree, etc...

 

[ThatDudeWithTheFood]

But see that's a reason that we follow the religion because no one has ever changed or added on to the Qu'ran.Most muslims adapt and change to have it fit in with their life.Most muslims don't pray 5 times a day because they don't think its necessary.

 

[Ritsuki]

For me, that's the main problem. I don't mind if some muslims decide not to pray 5 times a day. It's their choice. But some of the choices, and more precisely, some fatwas are totally wrong. Like the whole polemic around the burqa. Now everybody thinks that islam is a sexist religion, and blah blah. The only thing said in the Quran is that women should cover themselves from the knees to the shoulders, and hide their hair in public to avoid men to be tempted. But some countries decided that women will have to wear some dark and plain suits, to be totally unseen. And for me, that's a bad interpretation. So for me, the "solution" would be that everyone follows the same islam, some revised islam. Or that people understand that islam is not praticed in the same form everywhere. Unfortunately, most of the thing we see on the media are the bad interpretations of islam and that's a shame...

 

[TrolleyDave]

I know that there are certainly a lot more terrorist organisations, but the thing I wanted to point out is that most of the people thinks that they some kind of super international organisations, and in fact, most of them are only a bunch of crazy guys. In France, they're talking about Al-Qaeda Mahgreb, just like if it was an international compagny... I admit that it's strange that they're all muslims, But why ? Is it really because of the religion ? Or is it because those people are totally screwed ? Or maybe they live in a really hard situation and people are just abusing them ? I really want to understand.

Al-Qaeda doesn't actually exist as an organisation. It's more like a collective heading a collection of groups. It helps with the propaganda to make us think that there's a huge ominous organisation out to get us. Think of Al-Qaeda more like the Mafia. They're all categorised as the Mafia, but there's hundreds of different families and gangs across the world with varying ties to each other.

QUOTE(Ritsuki @ Oct 9 2010, 01:09 AM) Personally, I think it's because islam is a pretty "old-school" religion, and some of the rules are not adapted to our time. A second element would be that there are too much interpretations of the Quran, so it's easy to brainwash weak people or simply interpret the writing as we wish. So for me the real problem is more the people than the religion itself.

Islam is pretty young really when compared to the other major religions. It's only around 1300 or so years old. There aren't really supposed to be off-shoots of Islams, it's whole idea is a sectless religion following a codified political, legal and social structure. Although the reality is that there are several sects in Islam so yes there are several interpretations of the religion, like Sunni, Shia etc.

 

[tehnoobshow]

im a muslim and im wandering why every1 has a stereotyocial view of us and why does every1 think that were all terroists and wnat to kill oursleves for god.

cud sum explain why im constantly subjected to stereotypical abuse by some of my mates for the above reason.

and plus what ur opinions on this?

thanks
It's brought to my attention that you can't type/speak English very well.
That doesn't matter though, because the Muslims in my country (or atleast at my sister's school, her school is the worst school in the country anyway, it even said that in the papers) don't know (more than) one word Dutch!

I dont feel that muslims are terrorists or anything.Its just that some of the muslims in my area are so flipping rude.
Alot of muslims i know off are toughies which are always assholes and if you do something to them they say ''Don't be so sturdy'' and then i say ''You are the one who's being sturdy' arghhhhhhhhhh, i want to punch those dicks in the face!
But not all muslims are like that, just alot in the Netherlands.

lol i can speak english fluently and myself and my parents were born and raised in the uk
i was just speed typing

I know that there are certainly a lot more terrorist organisations, but the thing I wanted to point out is that most of the people thinks that they some kind of super international organisations, and in fact, most of them are only a bunch of crazy guys. In France, they're talking about Al-Qaeda Mahgreb, just like if it was an international compagny... I admit that it's strange that they're all muslims, But why ? Is it really because of the religion ? Or is it because those people are totally screwed ? Or maybe they live in a really hard situation and people are just abusing them ? I really want to understand.

Al-Qaeda doesn't actually exist as an organisation. It's more like a collective heading a collection of groups. It helps with the propaganda to make us think that there's a huge ominous organisation out to get us. Think of Al-Qaeda more like the Mafia. They're all categorised as the Mafia, but there's hundreds of different families and gangs across the world with varying ties to each other.

Personally, I think it's because islam is a pretty "old-school" religion, and some of the rules are not adapted to our time. A second element would be that there are too much interpretations of the Quran, so it's easy to brainwash weak people or simply interpret the writing as we wish. So for me the real problem is more the people than the religion itself.

Islam is pretty young really when compared to the other major religions. It's only around 1300 or so years old. There aren't really supposed to be off-shoots of Islams, it's whole idea is a sectless religion following a codified political, legal and social structure. Although the reality is that there are several sects in Islam so yes there are several interpretations of the religion, like Sunni, Shia etc.

TrolleyDave pretty much got everything nailed

QUOTE(The Pi @ Oct 8 2010, 11:28 PM)

QUOTE(tehnoobshow @ Oct 8 2010, 08:14 PM)

im a muslim and im wandering why every1 has a stereotyocial view of us and why does every1 think that were all terroists and wnat to kill oursleves for god.

cud sum explain why im constantly subjected to stereotypical abuse by some of my mates for the above reason.

and plus what ur opinions on this?

thanks

hypocrite

okay my bad i should have only written the the idotic and uneducated masses that are brainwashed by fox news and sky news

 

[Thoob]

I have the same view of Muslims as I do all other religious people. I think that they are deluded; brainwashed from birth into their parents' religion. However, I tend to be more tolerant of other religions - my best friend is a Christian - as they do not (in modern times) commit atrocities in the name of their religion. And while the majority of Muslims are good people, they stand idly by whilst others of their faith commit horrific suicide bombings. Compare this to the scandal of Catholic priests in Ireland. There were mass protests by Catholics enraged by the shame brought upon them by people that they were supposed to respect. But do you see Muslims lining the streets, protesting against terrorism? Nope. This leads me to think that most Muslims actually support terrorism, whether they are conscious of that is a different matter. So although all Muslims aren't terrorists, most terrorists are Muslims.

I think you forgot the Crusades, the inquisition, the Wars of religion and the forced conversions into catholicism during colonialism. And that wasn't only a bunch of extremists.

I did not forget them. I specifically put that part in because of the crusades, inquisition, etc.

learn2read.

 

[BobTheJoeBob]

Yeah sure. Do note though, I originally read the Qu'ran in it's original language, arabic. I've only started relatively recently to read the Qu'ran in an English translation and analysis.

That's alright, they're less questions on the Qu'ran and more about some beliefs and ideologies, and your application of them. Even though they say the Qu'ran is hard to translate the general gist of alot of the ideologies, both political and social, still comes across. Hopefully we can help to shatter some stereotypes in this thread.

I argue with alot of EDL members and see alot of the propaganda they push so they're questions are mostly based on shattering that propaganda if you get me.

What's your take on the ideology of Dar-al-Islam, Dar-al-Harb and Dar-al-Kufr (sorry if the spelling is incorrect) in modern society?
What's your take on the rule of not making friends with non-believers? You obviously don't follow it, or at least you a good job of hiding it if you do! lol
Music, yes or no?
What's your view on Wahabbi?
What's your opinion on the political ideology embedded in Islam? Such as higher taxes for non-believers, a seperated area for non-believers and that kind of thing.
Right-wingers tend to push forward the idea that Taqqiya (spelling?) is the right in Islam to lie in the promotion of Islam. It's not though is it? Isn't it just the right to denounce your faith if your life is in danger?
In the Qu'ran it states that when living in a non-Islamic state you should follow and abide by their laws. What's your opinion on those who say that all Muslims actively seek to have the full Sharia law and penal system introduced?
What's your view on Islamists?
The Burqa, cultural or religious? What's your opinion on what the Qu'ran states? Is it just the Hajib a requirement or do you believe full body covering is implied?
This one may seem a strange question, but it's about culture. I know you're English, but what country are your parents/grand-parents/great-grand-parents from or are you White English Muslim? I usually ask this because the severity of belief differs from country to country.

EDIT : Oh yeah, forgot one. What's your view on Anjem Choudray? (Can't remember how to spell his name but don't have enough respect for the bloke to care)

I've got a few more if you don't mind but I didn't want to bog you down.

Sorry for my very late reply, I went beddy bye.

1. Well their not in the Qu'ran or the Haddith so I see no need for them.
2. I have lots of friends who are Non-Believers. And if I did only make friends with muslims, I wouldn't have many friends.

3. Music, in my personal opinion is alright, although I do try to avoid it during Ramadan.
4. I don't know too much Wahhabi, but I can say from what I know a lot of the stuff they do is wrong.
5. TBH I don't have much opinion on that.
6. Your right. To be precise, you may conceal your religion if in danger.
7. Well forcing a law system onto a country using violence is wrong, it's better to use word of the mouth. And if you are in another country then you should abide by their laws.
8. By islamists I assume your referring to extreme muslims. Well, as long as they don't cause violence, disruption or kill any innocent people, then their not much of a problem. But if they do kill innocent people, then their not muslim, IMO.
9. From what I know the Qu'ran says to cover from the toes to neck and cover your hair, not only so your eyes are showing, and even that's a should not a must. And it's more important for married woman to do it, but as said, it's a should not a must.
10. My parents are from Pakistan but I was born in raised in England.

 

[Blood Fetish]

9. From what I know the Qu'ran says to cover from the toes to neck and cover your hair, not only so your eyes are showing, and even that's a should not a must. And it's more important for married woman to do it, but as said, it's a should not a must.

In what way is this not objectifying women?

 

[LeoSan]

I am a Muslim and I was wondering why everyone has a stereotypical view of us and why does everyone think that were all terrorists and want to kill ourselves for god.

could some explain why I am constantly subjected to stereotypical abuse by some of my mates for the above reason.

and plus what your opinions on this?

thanks

They are just afraid of anything that's different.

-------------

I just don't share the horrible gender discrimination of your religion, but whatever, it's your culture and I respect that.

 

[Slyakin]

Oh great. Another one of THESE threads.

I don't want to comment though. I'm a Muslim, but I'd prefer for things to just die down. I'm not looking for answers.

 

[Blood Fetish]

Oh great. Another one of THESE threads.

I don't want to comment though. I'm a Muslim, but I'd prefer for things to just die down. I'm not looking for answers.

Ignoring things is the best way to make them go away.

 

[LeoSan]

Ignoring things is the best way to make them go away.

Nope, declaring war is the best way

 

[tehnoobshow]

Ignoring things is the best way to make them go away.

Nope, declaring war is the best way

now that is a broad outlook on things...lol

 

[The Catboy]

Really all these stereotypes just come from the amount shit the press can pump out to make everyone that isn't a white Christen male seem lesser. Watch the news back when 9/11 happened, all it was was news about how bad the terrorist are and since the terrorist just happened to have been Muslims, all Muslims are now going to be stuck with the stigma that they are all terrorist.

 

[Blood Fetish]

Disagreed. I don't know how old you are, but I was alive and an adult in 2001. I watched it happen live. Not even Fox News was saying that since the attacks seemed to be carried out by Muslims then all Muslims are terrorists.

 

[Zetta_x]

The problem is that the average societal person is blind. People grow up believing what they believe not because they individually saw it, but because they are told to believe it. It can get into a huge intense morality discussion, but people are trained to believe certain things are right and wrong because society says so. This makes powerful people like the government to conditionally train the average societal person as tools using media and other various forms of communication. While intentions to make someone believe things like Muslims are bad may not be clear, by taking world events we can make some inferences (correct or not) of said intentions.

 

[tehnoobshow]

i agree

 

[TrolleyDave]

Sorry for my very late reply, I went beddy bye.

1. Well their not in the Qu'ran or the Haddith so I see no need for them.
2. I have lots of friends who are Non-Believers. And if I did only make friends with muslims, I wouldn't have many friends.

3. Music, in my personal opinion is alright, although I do try to avoid it during Ramadan.
4. I don't know too much Wahhabi, but I can say from what I know a lot of the stuff they do is wrong.
5. TBH I don't have much opinion on that.
6. Your right. To be precise, you may conceal your religion if in danger.
7. Well forcing a law system onto a country using violence is wrong, it's better to use word of the mouth. And if you are in another country then you should abide by their laws.
8. By islamists I assume your referring to extreme muslims. Well, as long as they don't cause violence, disruption or kill any innocent people, then their not much of a problem. But if they do kill innocent people, then their not muslim, IMO.
9. From what I know the Qu'ran says to cover from the toes to neck and cover your hair, not only so your eyes are showing, and even that's a should not a must. And it's more important for married woman to do it, but as said, it's a should not a must.
10. My parents are from Pakistan but I was born in raised in England.

1) Dar al-Islam is mentioned in the Qu'ran but the other 2 aren't. Dar al-Kufr is either in the Hadith or the Qu'ran somewhere. Mohammed used the term to refer to the outlying tribes who hadn't converted to Islam. Dar-al-Harb was used later on by scholars during one of the Caliphs. Basically it was just using Islam as a cover for political and territorial aspirations, well in my opinion anyway.
2) Yeah, I've met very few Muslims who abide by that one! lol Some of the more devout Muslims from the Arabic territories do follow it, even when living in non-Islamic countries. I could understand the reasoning for it when Islam was created by Mohammed, but these days it's a totally diffeent story.
3) Asking a Muslim about his stance on music is a good way to find out how "extreme" a Muslim follows the religion. You always get one of three answers - "Music is fine", "Music is fine, but mixed sex dancing is not" and "Music is haram"! It's usually Muslims who come from the more extreme countries like Iran and Saudi that are against music.
4) Not really much more can be said of that! lol
5) This is a question alot of Muslims don't really have of an opinion on, but the political ideology in Islam pays an important part of the religion so I ask it each time.
6) It's a shame more people don't actually look it up once told about it. Unfortunately they're are too eager to believe the propaganda pushed by the right.
7) This is pretty much what the average Muslim believes. I've met very few that believe that Sharia should be installed anywhere except Islamic countries. I read a great article by a British scholar about why a system like Sharia shouldn't be installed in country like the UK but unfortunately can't find it now.
8) Sorry, no, I probably should have explained better. I don't consider terrorists or those that use violence and fear as Islamists, they're terrorists simple as. No by Islamists I mean the political arm of Islam. Those that seek to convert countries to resemble Caliphs as closely as possible through politics and legal means. Such as introducing the Sharia legal and penal system, the covering of women, banning of images of Mohammed and prophets, blasphemy laws etc.
9) That's basically how I interpret what the Qu'ran says as well. I've read the justification for forcing the veil on women and it's pretty sketchy in my opinion.
10) Yeah, I thought you might be of Pakistani descent judging from your views. I find Pakistani Muslims to be the most moderate of all Muslims. Don't get me wrong, I've met some that are pretty extreme but the average bloke/lass is as easy going as the next guy. They're still faithful, but Islam is more of a spiritual thing than a literal thing if you get me.

A few more questions, some of these are a little tougher and feel free not to answer them if you don't want to, I won't be offended or anything.

1) What's your view on the punishment for leaving Islam?
2) What's your opinion on Salman Rushdie and the fatwa on him?
3) What's your view on the section in the Qu'ran that entitles a man to "lay hands" on his wife?
4) Pictures and photographs of people and animals, yes or no?
5) What's your opinion on child marriages like in countries like Iran, Yemen and Afghanistan?
6) Criticism of Islam and Mohammed, allowed or not allowed?
7) In countries like Iran and Saudi emphasis is placed on men to imitate Mohammed as closely as possible (the "Perfect man" theory), in some cases even down to the length of beard. Do you think this is, or at least borders on, idolatry?
8) Trousers for women, yes or no?

QUOTE9. From what I know the Qu'ran says to cover from the toes to neck and cover your hair, not only so your eyes are showing, and even that's a should not a must. And it's more important for married woman to do it, but as said, it's a should not a must.

In what way is this not objectifying women?

Islam heavily objectifies women, just in a different way to our society.

 

[Blood Fetish]

In what way is this not objectifying women?

Islam heavily objectifies women, just in a different way to our society.

Sure, all societies objectify different groups to certain degrees. I don't think that means we should be so dismissive. For example, just because the US has fashion magazines does not mean they have no ground to talk about Muslims forcing women to cover their entire body, stoning them to death because the husband decides he is bored of her and wants a new partner, etc. Those are not equal things.