Hacking Why is team Xecuter not sued by Nintendo?

[smf]

And look at how much of a success Nintendo was at that too.

In europe they did quite a good job against ds cards.

TC thinks Nintendo can just sue TX and this will disappear but really it won't, it will make matters even worse for Nintendo

Suing TX won't make it worse for them, it will just cost them lawyer and court fees. But unless TX has broken a law in their home country then it will be the importers who are targeted. They have been willing to try that in the past.

this is why Microsoft allows homebrew onto Xbox One X and such, they have realised it's better to reach out than to completely fight hackers head on over and over and I know Xbox One is hard to hack but who needs to hack it when you can use homebrew and retroarch on it without hacking it.

That side steps the issue, but it's something that Sony did on the PS1 & PS2 for a high price before doing it for free on the PS3 and instantly regretting it. While Nintendo have never tried it.

Where we are today is that Nintendo don't allow that, they are now faced with a hack that allows piracy and they have to do something about it. Bending over and taking it is unlikely to be their first response.

 

[Localhorst86]

That side steps the issue, but it's something that Sony did on the PS1 & PS2 for a high price before doing it for free on the PS3 and instantly regretting it.

Where did Sony allow homebrew development on the PS1 and PS2? Even on the PS3, they only gave people a sandboxed linux and it was Sony taking away that feature that really got the ball rolling.

 

[Zumoly]

This is my opinion but do you think Nintendo is not 'even' aware / does not care about what's going on?
By now every big company knows there's going to be piracy anyway so why bother to fight a lost battle?
My take on this is that Nintendo will ban only based on suspicious activity on their servers from a user/console and just leave the rest be.

 

[Heran Bago]

You're probably not going to get a lot of international legal specialists on this site.

 

[kevin corms]

Most people aren't pirating anyway.

 

[contezero]

Where did Sony allow homebrew development on the PS1 and PS2? Even on the PS3, they only gave people a sandboxed linux and it was Sony taking away that feature that really got the ball rolling.

They sold the NET Yaroze dev system for PS1 and there was an official Linux distro for PS2

 

[smf]

Where did Sony allow homebrew development on the PS1 and PS2?

Net Yaroze and PS2 Linux kit.

Even on the PS3, they only gave people a sandboxed linux and it was Sony taking away that feature that really got the ball rolling.

Sony removed Other OS from the PS3 because George Holtz was using it for hacking Game OS (and then talking about it, to drum up publicity for himself).

Xbox One homebrew is also in a sandbox, you can only write Universal Windows Platform apps. They've recently increased what you can do with UWP apps, but it's still not native.

None of the console manufacturers have ever let you write homebrew in the exact same way as official developers write games.

Microsoft did UWP on the xbox one after someone leaked an official SDK hoping that it would slow down hacking if people didn't need to do it, but according to google an xbox one hack is imminent.

 

[Localhorst86]

Net Yaroze and PS2 Linux kit.



Sony removed Linux from the PS3 because George Holtz was using it for hacking Game OS.

Xbox One homebrew is also in a sandbox, you can only write Universal Windows Platform apps. They've recently increased what you can do with UWP apps, but it's still not native.

None of the console manufacturers have ever let you write homebrew in the exact same way as official developers write games.

As far as I know, Net Yaroze content really only worked with a Net Yaroze device. There was no way to make them work on any PS1. It's a different beast than the Xbox One Homebrew where you can take any retail xbox one and enable developer mode.

Let's also point out that Sony only created the Linux PS2 Kit in order to be able to declare the console as a computer instead of a gaming console for customs reasons (unsuccessfully, I might add).

Both the PS2s Linux as well as PS3s otherOS were far more limited in terms of what they allowed you to do (OtherOS didn't have 3D accelleration, iirc.) and while the xbox one is also limited to UWP apps, their limitation is far less than what we have seen before. I do feel that microsoft has successfully found a great middle ground that gives people just enough freedom in terms of homebrew to vastly reduce the motiviation to crack the console wide open.

 

[smf]

As far as I know, Net Yaroze content really only worked with a Net Yaroze device.

You could also submit them to a magazine and if they were good enough they would put them on a CD cover disc. Considering the technical limitations, this is about as good as you could get. Look at what happened when dreamcast supported unlicensed content with Mil-CD, I think Sony got the balance right.

Let's also point out that Sony only created the Linux PS2 Kit in order to be able to declare the console as a computer instead of a gaming console for customs reasons (unsuccessfully, I might add).

Sony have always liked *ix. The PS1 SDK for Windows only came later when they were forced to by western developers, they keep trying to push for *ix. So I think it's naive to say it was the only reason. It was unsuccessful and yet they continued funding it.

I do feel that microsoft has successfully found a great middle ground that gives people just enough freedom in terms of homebrew to vastly reduce the motiviation to crack the console wide open.

Maybe, or maybe nobody wants the fun of hacking an xbox one into what would essentially be a windows pc once you're done with it. Quite a lot of people in the hacking scene like *ix too.

The capabilities of homebrew on xbox one in the early days was pretty bad, windows 10 introduces UWP and then recently they lifted some of the artificial limits.

 

[masterspike52]

Why isn't apple suing saurik for making cydia...

It's not what's being made that's the issue it's how the end user is using it.

I actually want everyone to note this, its like Utorrent, the program itself isnt illegal, its just what its used for thats illegal

 

[zoogie]

https://ap.nintendo.com/news/press.jsp

Nintendo has, and will go after modchip/flashcart merchants and manufacturers.
They can't get everybody though. Especially when the targets are based in countries with lax copyright enforcement.
TX has the advantage of being at the top of the supplier food chain, way out of the reach of the big N.

 

[kumikochan]

Illegal in the US and EU, elsewhere it's more complex.

Nintendo will go after the companies importing them, if they can identify shipments then they'll have them seized.

That is what they did for DS flashcarts. They sued lots of importers.

It is not illegal everywhere in the Eu. Modification shops selling hardware exploits and so forth in the middle of the street paying taxes and everything are in abundance here. Also by European law it is perfectly legal to backup as long as you don't make a profit out of it and own the product. Even downloading something is perfectly fine if you own it.

 

[Paulsar99]

Because china don't care.

 

[smf]

It is not illegal everywhere in the Eu. Modification shops selling hardware exploits and so forth in the middle of the street paying taxes and everything are in abundance here. Also by European law it is perfectly legal to backup as long as you don't make a profit out of it and own the product. Even downloading something is perfectly fine if you own it.

That is not really true.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Directive

Article 6 of the Copyright Directive requires that Member States must provide "adequate legal protection" against the intentional circumvention of "effective technological measures" designed to prevent or restrict acts of copying not authorised by the rightholders of any copyright, related right or the sui generis right in databases (preamble paragraph 47). Member States must also provide "adequate legal protection" against the manufacture, import, distribution, sale, rental, advertisement, or possession "for commercial purposes of devices, products or components or the provision of services which

• are promoted, advertised or marketed for the purpose of circumvention of, or
• have only a limited commercially significant purpose or use other than to circumvent, or
• are primarily designed, produced, adapted or performed for the purpose of enabling or facilitating the circumvention of, any effective technological measures."

Not all countries have enacted this into law and some of those countries have already been prosecuted in the European Courts for failing to implement it. Whether they enforce the law is another matter. People doing something is no proof that it's not illegal, or there would be no crime.

SX OS should be entirely illegal in the EU, like ds carts were. The law doesn't care whether the circumvention was for non infringing purposes, it's illegal even if you only use it to play backups of games you own or to run software that you have written yourself. This is largely similar to the DMCA in the US & CADA in Australia.

Similar laws will probably be rolled out to other regions, because it comes from the WIPO Copyright Treaty.

 

[kumikochan]

That is not really true.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Copyright_Directive

Article 6 of the Copyright Directive requires that Member States must provide "adequate legal protection" against the intentional circumvention of "effective technological measures" designed to prevent or restrict acts of copying not authorised by the rightholders of any copyright, related right or the sui generis right in databases (preamble paragraph 47). Member States must also provide "adequate legal protection" against the manufacture, import, distribution, sale, rental, advertisement, or possession "for commercial purposes of devices, products or components or the provision of services which

• are promoted, advertised or marketed for the purpose of circumvention of, or
• have only a limited commercially significant purpose or use other than to circumvent, or
• are primarily designed, produced, adapted or performed for the purpose of enabling or facilitating the circumvention of, any effective technological measures."

Not all countries have enacted this into law and some of those countries have already been prosecuted in the European Courts for failing to implement it. Whether they enforce the law is another matter. People doing something is no proof that it's not illegal, or there would be no crime.

SX OS should be entirely illegal in the EU, like ds carts were. The law doesn't care whether the circumvention was for non infringing purposes, it's illegal even if you only use it to play backups of games you own or to run software that you have written yourself. This is largely similar to the DMCA in the US & CADA in Australia.

Similar laws will probably be rolled out to other regions, because it comes from the WIPO Copyright Treaty.

Then explain to me all the hardware software exploit shops in thé Netherlands ?

 

[smf]

Then explain to me all the hardware software exploit shops in thé Netherlands ?

My first thoughts are either lack of awareness or turning a blind eye.

Which is similar to the netherlands drug policy.

 

[Risingdawn]

Runs the risk of losing the case in court, costing alot of money and opening the flood gates for future gray-market hardware.

Basically it costs too much, with no visible quantifiable return, at too high risk.

Companies generally issue cease and desist orders; they are cheap, have no future legal ramifications and are usually enough to scare most folks without a knowledge of the legality behind the request.

People like TX know that China make far too much money off of 'dodgy exports' to ever rule against it in a court of law, Nintendo know this too.

 

[MadonnaProject]

Why do you care? Why is it that such form of vigilanee "do gooder" attitude exists with nintendo fans? Who cares?

 

[smf]

It is legal under thé tolerated rules. Only however when they don't follow those rules they Will get prosecuted. I am reading thé dutch version and pretty sure the english version is badly translated

You're mistaking law and policy. Legality is purely related to law. The question "why is this allowed" is related to policy.

 

[kumikochan]

No. It doesn't. It clearly states that it is illegal.

Post us a source that sais that it is legal and we will concede.

So according to you someone who doesn't live here and doesn't know a single thing about thé law here you can perfectly fijne open up a business without thé need of registering it through legal means