Austria first country to make Covid vaccine mandatory

[Lacius]

Weird, I thought we were talking about your claim not mine but I guess it makes sense since you can't back up what you said.

If you get to (incorrectly) point out that I don't have evidence to back up a claim, I certainly get to correctly point out that you don't have evidence to back up a claim. In addition to making an important point about how your claim isn't backed up by scientific evidence nor shared by the scientific community, it demonstrates your hypocrisy.

You are nothing but a corporate drone

I work in the public sector, lol.

I'm pretty much done with extending you any courtesies not to mention get absolutely no value from any discourse with you. I won't be replying to any of your posts from now on so consider that a Christmas gift from me to you.

If you paid more attention to my posts, and applied some skepticism and scientific inquiry to your ideas, you'd make a lot fewer posts that were foolish.

 

[Dakitten]

The Opposite is possible.....Learn to live with it and accept it.
The Pandemic is never over,if some "People with Decision Power" won´t let it end......

Isn't that the whole idea of why the world needs a mandate and why Austria is showing positive leadership in this regard?

Weird, I thought we were talking about your claim not mine but I guess it makes sense since you can't back up what you said.

You are nothing but a corporate drone and propagandist @Lacius. I'm pretty much done with extending you any courtesies not to mention get absolutely no value from any discourse with you. I won't be replying to any of your posts from now on so consider that a Christmas gift from me to you.

Comrade, you're the one making a bold claim, so the burden of proof kinda falls on you. You can call people naieve and stupid, but unless you've got numbers to back it up, this just further kills your credibility. Lacius, on the other hand, has a lovely track record which lends to his reputation, regardless of if you appreciate his efforts.

 

[Lacius]

Isn't that the whole idea of why the world needs a mandate and why Austria is showing positive leadership in this regard?


Comrade, you're the one making a bold claim, so the burden of proof kinda falls on you. You can call people naieve and stupid, but unless you've got numbers to back it up, this just further kills your credibility. Lacius, on the other hand, has a lovely track record which lends to his reputation, regardless of if you appreciate his efforts.

@subcon959 very recently posted something that was nonsense, and he comes after me for making a statement proven by studies that demonstrate the efficacy of the vaccines, lol.

 

[appleburger]

This thread is a dumpster fire - which is why I devolved into calling people morons on this thread after trying to keep a decent conversation in previous, similar threads.

This really doesn't belong on this site. We need to just let these conversations go onto sites where discussing medical science is actually productive, and the "medical freedom" retards will get slaughtered with logic, deny it, and continue running in circles.

This truly is not up for debate in the medical field, and it's sad some people here really think they have a foothold when it's so obvious they still haven't looked up how a vaccines or air born viruses work. You live in the internet age. There's no excuse.

And the "opinions" you degenerates are using to argue with us here actually do affect people. Lives are at stake. Saying "omg why can't I just state a completely ignorant non-educated opinion without getting flamed" is hilariously stupid, because in case you folks didn't notice a lot of people are dying and we know that misinformation/lack of education has made the problem worse. You're part of the problem and should absolutely be ashamed and get flamed. Not sorry about that one bit.

If you want to argue with people on a subject involving the deaths of all your comrades, do your fucking research first or you'll get called out. Which has already happened multiple times on these threads involving the same core people.

 

[subcon959]

Comrade, you're the one making a bold claim, so the burden of proof kinda falls on you. You can call people naieve and stupid, but unless you've got numbers to back it up, this just further kills your credibility. Lacius, on the other hand, has a lovely track record which lends to his reputation, regardless of if you appreciate his efforts.

I think I've made it clear before that building rep isn't something I'm even remotely interested in. I only come here to discuss ideas and occasionally when I feel particularly strongly about something I'll throw a passionate comment out there. I have no issues with you as you've always been pretty reasonable and at least it feels like I'm talking to a real person with you as opposed to some sort of A.I that's been poorly programmed. It gets tiring dealing with moving goal posts and straw men all the time, so I've chosen to break my no-censorship policy and put the first person ever on my ignore list.. and I've spoke to jimbo so that says something.

 

[appleburger]

Maybe go here: https://www.scienceforums.net/forum/22-medical-science/

 

[Lacius]

I think I've made it clear before that building rep isn't something I'm even remotely interested in. I only come here to discuss ideas and occasionally when I feel particularly strongly about something I'll throw a passionate comment out there. I have no issues with you as you've always been pretty reasonable and at least it feels like I'm talking to a real person with you as opposed to some sort of A.I that's been poorly programmed. It gets tiring dealing with moving goal posts and straw men all the time, so I've chosen to break my no-censorship policy and put the first person ever on my ignore list.. and I've spoke to jimbo so that says something.

I guess some people can't take the heat, and by heat, I mean science.

 

[Foxi4]

You have zero evidence of this.

The idea that COVID would just magically go poof and vanish if people in what is broadly considered as “the civilised world” just got the jab is utopian and nonsensical. There’s billions of people in the third world who have limited or non-existent access to vaccines and they would perpetuate the virus, creating more mutations in the process and passing them right back with every crate of bananas or other exotic goods you buy - sailors exist, pilots exist. It’s an utterly ridiculous statement supported by nothing. Most people in civilised countries are already vaccinated, multiple times, and that didn’t stop squat. In fact, if we’re talking about science, it is statistically *extremely unlikely* that COVID will *ever* be completely eradicated, and waiting for that is a fool’s errand. That ship has long since sailed, COVID is present on every single continent on the planet, with plenty of carriers to go around. At some point we will simply become immune to it as a population, and it will enter the sizeable family of what we call “seasonal viruses”, just like swine flu, bird flu and other diseases that were referred to as pandemics.

 

[appleburger]

The idea that COVID would just magically go poof and vanish if people in what is broadly considered as “the civilised world” just got the jab is utopian and nonsensical. There’s billions of people in the third world who have limited or non-existent access to vaccines and they would perpetuate the virus, creating more mutations in the process and passing them right back with every crate of bananas or other exotic goods you buy - sailors exist, pilots exist. It’s an utterly ridiculous statement supported by nothing. Most people in civilised countries are already vaccinated, multiple times, and that didn’t stop squat. In fact, if we’re talking about science, it is statistically *extremely unlikely* that COVID will *ever* be completely eradicated, and waiting for that is a fool’s errand. That ship has long since sailed, COVID is present on every single continent on the planet, with plenty of carriers to go around. At some point we will simply become immune to it as a population, and it will enter the sizeable family of what we call “seasonal viruses”, just like swine flu, bird flu and other diseases that were referred to as pandemics.

You don't know what you're talking about. See the spanish flu and polio maybe for starters.

And nobody is perpetuating COVID magically going away. You goofed.

 

[Foxi4]

You don't know what you're talking about. See the spanish flu and polio maybe for starters.

And nobody is perpetuating COVID magically going away. You goofed.

Polio did not spread like COVID. At this stage, with this many carriers, the most likely scenario is that COVID will become endemic. The likelihood of eradication is almost nil.

EDIT: For the record, we didn’t eradicate the Spanish Flu either. The specific strain that caused it became an ever-present but manageable threat - it was one of the many variants of H1N1. *You* don’t know what you’re talking about. Polio also continues to exist, although cases in the civilised world are few and far between - fallen by over 99% thanks to immunisation. Nevertheless, you get cases of Polio even today, mostly in the third world.

 

[appleburger]

Polio did not spread like COVID. At this stage, with this many carriers, the most likely scenario is that COVID will become endemic. The likelihood of eradication is almost nil.

That was in response to your vaccine comments.

By the way, COVID's insane spread is what makes it a pandemic. Which is why your comment that seasonal viruses were considered pandemics is factually just wrong. They were never declared pandemics. Spanish flu was the last one, according to Google.

You have no idea what the likelihood of eradication is, and neither does anybody else, yet. Jury is still out on that.

 

[subcon959]

The idea that COVID would just magically go poof and vanish if people in what is broadly considered as “the civilised world” just got the jab is utopian and nonsensical. There’s billions of people in the third world who have limited or non-existent access to vaccines and they would perpetuate the virus, creating more mutations in the process and passing them right back with every crate of bananas or other exotic goods you buy - sailors exist, pilots exist. It’s an utterly ridiculous statement supported by nothing. Most people in civilised countries are already vaccinated, multiple times, and that didn’t stop squat. In fact, if we’re talking about science, it is statistically *extremely unlikely* that COVID will *ever* be completely eradicated, and waiting for that is a fool’s errand. That ship has long since sailed, COVID is present on every single continent on the planet, with plenty of carriers to go around. At some point we will simply become immune to it as a population, and it will enter the sizeable family of what we call “seasonal viruses”, just like swine flu, bird flu and other diseases that were referred to as pandemics.

That's right. At this stage, most resources should be going towards treatments for those that end up hospitalised. So much more is known now than back when everyone was watching people in Italy on ventilators. There are protocols that have shown very promising results involving mabs, prednisolone and various anti-virals.

 

[Foxi4]

That was in response to your vaccine comments.

By the way, COVID's insane spread is what makes it a pandemic. Which is why your comment that seasonal viruses were considered pandemics is factually just wrong. They were never declared pandemics. Spanish flu was the last one, according to Google.

You have no idea what the likelihood of eradication is, and neither does anybody else, yet. Jury is still out on that.

Leading experts are leaning towards endemic. My comment was correct. Hate to quote Nature, but you have Google too if you want more specific data.

https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-021-00396-2

 

[BitMasterPlus]

In reference to comments further above:
A communist and a propagandist lecturing others on not following the science and calling them dumb, it'd almost make for a set up for a sitcom if it wasn't so sad that people like these are the possible future of the USA.

 

[appleburger]

Polio did not spread like COVID. At this stage, with this many carriers, the most likely scenario is that COVID will become endemic. The likelihood of eradication is almost nil.

EDIT: For the record, we didn’t eradicate the Spanish Flu either. The specific strain that caused it became an ever-present but manageable threat - it was one of the many variants of H1N1. *You* don’t know what you’re talking about. Polio also continues to exist, although cases in the civilised world are few and far between - fallen by over 99% thanks to immunisation. Nevertheless, you get cases of Polio even today, mostly in the third world.

I didn't claim we eradicated it. You're making assumptions. It was in response to your vaccine comments, like I said. The whole point of vaccinating is to prevent spread. We did that with Spanich flu and polio. I'm well aware they still exist. That's not the point.

You're right about the experts now leaning towards COVID becoming an endemic - I goofed on that. Last I bothered looking it up, it was still up in the air. I'll take that hit.

 

[appleburger]

That's right. At this stage, most resources should be going towards treatments for those that end up hospitalised. So much more is known now than back when everyone was watching people in Italy on ventilators. There are protocols that have shown very promising results involving mabs, prednisolone and various anti-virals.

Hospitals filling up is still an issue. Vaccination is a very effective stop-gap to help alleviate the hospital burden. Are anti-virals helping those out with breathing issues? Like, cases where ventilators would be needed are now prevented largely by anti-virals? I haven't heard about this, yet.

 

[bazamuffin]

 

[Foxi4]

I didn't claim we eradicated it. You're making assumptions. It was in response to your vaccine comments, like I said. The whole point of vaccinating is to prevent spread. We did that with Spanich flu and polio. I'm well aware they still exist. That's not the point.

You're right about the experts now leaning towards COVID becoming an endemic - I goofed on that. Last I bothered looking it up, it was still up in the air. I'll take that hit.

I’ll take the concession. Obviously vaccination will reduce spread and is highly recommended, I never claimed otherwise and I’m a strong proponent of vaccines - they work, everyone should choose to take them in order to boost their own immunity, thus protecting their own health and the health of others. My comment was strictly referencing people who think we will one day live in a “COVID-free” world, and that’s just not realistic, even if we all vaccinate tomorrow. There will always be new strains to contend with, but the disease will also gradually become less and less of a threat, with the odd crazy mutations being exceptions.

 

[appleburger]

I’ll take the concession. Obviously vaccination will reduce spread and is highly recommended, I never claimed otherwise and I’m a strong proponent of vaccines - they work, everyone should choose to take them in order to boost their own immunity, thus protecting their own health and the health of others. My comment was strictly referencing people who think we will one day live in a “COVID-free” world, and that’s just not realistic, even if we all vaccinate tomorrow. There will always be new strains to contend with, but the disease will also gradually become less and less of a threat, with the odd crazy mutations being exceptions.

Gotcha - I don't think that's a popular opinion - that anyone thinks COVID eradication is likely. History has shown that these diseases tend to stick around, and the goal is typically to reduce the spread until it's not longer a pandemic and we can manage it.

So, I made some assumptions about your post, myself. Sorry about that. You're not among the pack of folks on here who are trying to argue from random crap they've pulled out of their ass, and I appreciate that.

 

[Cyan]

we now have covid for 2 years, and (french at least) government still complain about filled hospital, no more bed available, no more equipement, no more workers etc.
2 years....
what did they do in 2 years ? they limited and decreased the number of beds (doing that for past 10 years), they let workers out, they didn't replace them, they didn't anticipate any new waves of covid or mutation.
They are limiting the number of medical equipment and wonder why hospital are full ?

THEY DIDN'T WORK ON EQUIPPING HOSPITALS TO TREAT THE PATIENTS !
and they complain they can't treat people and put the cause on unvaccinated people, even though France has more than 90% 18yo+ fully vaccinated. but, no, the issue is the unvaccinated ones, not the fact they didn't work on improving their system.


so, my question is, what did they do in two years to prevent that ??
why don't they mention their lack of work or organization ?
no, that's people's fault if they can't treat enough people.

edit:
they are maintaining the sentiment of overflowing cases by not increasing (if not decreasing) the medical care.