Far Right Presidential Candidate Wins in Argentina

[Foxi4]

We will see.

The problem with this line of thinking is that “we’ll see” in 20 or so years. Economic reform requires forward thinking.

 

[jomaper]

I'm asking for a reference to "the rights referred to herein". It doesn't say that a gathering of three or more is an unlawful protest. It's clarifying the terms of "gathering" and "demonstration" for subsequent articles/literature that clarify rights--which are missing from the post.

I'm starting to understand you more. You are doing the best that you can.

You can Google the rest of it. Feel free to come back to me when you find sufficient excuses to justify the fact that they're literally saying 3 people together in a public space can be considered a manifestation.

 

[tabzer]

You can Google the rest of it. Feel free to come back to me when you find sufficient excuses to justify the fact that they're literally saying 3 people together in a public space can be considered a manifestation.

You claimed "repression", and presented their definition of a gathering/demonstration as evidence.

How would you define a "gathering", "demonstration", or "manifestation"? Are you suggesting that the label is offensive?

"'gathering' or 'demonstration' is understood to be the intentional and temporary congregation of three (3) or more people in a public space for the purpose of exercising the rights referred to herein"

This is a preamble for for legal protest.

 

[Foxi4]

You can Google the rest of it. Feel free to come back to me when you find sufficient excuses to justify the fact that they're literally saying 3 people together in a public space can be considered a manifestation.

Three is actually quite generous. In the UK during the pandemic the word “gathering” was defined as “two or more people present together in the same place in order to engage in any form of social interaction with each other, or to undertake any other activity with each other”. Two. No joke.

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt5801/jtselect/jtrights/1328/132807.htm

This was later relaxed to 6, and later still to 30, but as far as the word “gathering” is concerned, “three or more” is as good a definition as any. Frankly, I don’t know why it needs a digit attached to it at all - people can effectively protest on an individual basis.

 

[jomaper]

Three is actually quite generous. In the UK during the pandemic the word “gathering” was defined as “two or more people present together in the same place in order to engage in any form of social interaction with each other, or to undertake any other activity with each other”. Two. No joke.

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/jt5801/jtselect/jtrights/1328/132807.htm

This was later relaxed to 6, and later still to 30, but as far as the word “gathering” is concerned, “three or more” is as good a definition as any. Frankly, I don’t know why it needs a digit attached to it at all - people can effectively protest on an individual basis.

Yeah because context doesn't matter, right? What happened during the pandemic was because of the pandemic. There is no excuse now.
Pro Milei media is claiming this is "unusual" instead of, you know, anti-democratic?
https://x.com/MauriElbueno/status/1740338613798244408

 

[tabzer]

Context does matter. What rights do you lose/gain by being apart of a gathering?

 

[jomaper]

Context does matter. What rights do you lose/gain by being apart of a gathering?

Gain? None lol. Lose? I told you, go read.
Now 4 people together on a plaza or park can be considered and treated as a protest.

 

[tabzer]

Gain? None lol. Lose? I told you, go read.
Now 4 people together on a plaza or park can be considered and treated as a protest.

If they are protesting. Protest is legal. I know the weight of legal penalties differ when you do something illegal as a group or as an individual, and they can be both lighter and heavier depending on the context.

 

[jomaper]

If they are protesting. Protest is legal. I know the weight of legal penalties differ when you do something illegal as a group or as an individual, and they can be both lighter and heavier depending on the context.

Are you being purposely obtuse? Do you even know how the whole "a few people gathered can be considered a protest" works in authoritarian governments? Do you know how it worked here in the past? They don't NEED you to actually be protesting because BY LAW they want to be able to consider it one if more than 3 people are together. They're LITERALLY saying people need to ask for permission to go group up in public spaces.

HOW THE FUCK IS THAT PRO-FREEDOM

 

[tabzer]

They're LITERALLY saying people need to ask for permission to go group up in public spaces.

What you quoted didn't say that. Defining a "manifestation" doesn't make it illegal. I've asked the question several times. Still no answer.

 

[jomaper]

What you quoted didn't say that. Defining a "manifestation" doesn't make it illegal. I've asked the question several times. Still no answer.

A manifestation here is treated as a protest. Hence it can be repressed.

 

[tabzer]

A manifestation here is treated as a protest. Hence it can be repressed.

Are going to say how? Afaik what you guys have been talking about regarding protests is doing it in the street.

An individual blocking traffic is probably illegal too, right? When did protests become illegal? The article you posted didn't say.

 

[Darth Meteos]

good luck argentina, you're gonna need it

Post automatically merged: Dec 28, 2023

Are going to say how? Afaik what you guys have been talking about regarding protests is doing it in the street.

An individual blocking traffic is probably illegal too, right? When did protests become illegal? The article you posted didn't say.

are you genuinely going 'well ackshually' about argentina's political situation to an argentinian
is that your deed for the day

 

[tabzer]

good luck argentina, you're gonna need it

Post automatically merged: Dec 28, 2023

are you genuinely going 'well ackshually' about argentina's political situation to an argentinian
is that your deed for the day

I'm referring to what was posted here. This isn't Argentina. Thanks for your platitudes.

 

[jomaper]

Are going to say how? Afaik what you guys have been talking about regarding protests is doing it in the street.

An individual blocking traffic is probably illegal too, right? When did protests become illegal? The article you posted didn't say.

I'm not answering to you anymore. Half of what you say is hard to understand and the other half is you asking me to educate you. Since you seem to know so much about my country go ahead and read the decreet that changes more than 300 laws and the latest omnibus law that changes 300 more.

 

[tabzer]

I'm not answering to you anymore. Half of what you say is hard to understand and the other half is you asking me to educate you. Since you seem to know so much about my country go ahead and read the decreet that changes more than 300 laws and the latest omnibus law that changes 300 more.

You posted:

(English translation) ARTICLE 331.- Meeting or demonstration. For the purposes of this Chapter of the law, "gathering" or
"demonstration" is understood to be the intentional and temporary congregation of three (3) or more people in a public
space for the purpose of exercising the rights referred to herein.

Then you said:

3 people together in a public space will be considered a "manifestation" and can be repressed.

I am asking: "How?"

If you've tried reading any contract/EULA/TOS, they all start in a very similar way by defining specific terms and the parties involved. That is not "repression". It is clarification. It isn't until later in the document that any claims of repression/abuse can be shown.

This is about what you posted and what you are saying about it.

 

[Dark_Ansem]

PleSe d

Are you being purposely obtuse? Do you even know how the whole "a few people gathered can be considered a protest" works in authoritarian governments? Do you know how it worked here in the past? They don't NEED you to actually be protesting because BY LAW they want to be able to consider it one if more than 3 people are together. They're LITERALLY saying people need to ask for permission to go group up in public spaces.

HOW THE FUCK IS THAT PRO-FREEDOM

Please don't indulge the slanderous troll.

 

[tabzer]

PleSe d

Please don't indulge the slanderous troll.

Are you being ironic or a hypocrite?

 

[Foxi4]

Gain? None lol. Lose? I told you, go read. Now 4 people together on a plaza or park can be considered and treated as a protest.

Functionally speaking a single person on a plaza or park can be considered a protest. It’s not a function of how many, it’s a function of what is going on. The law features definitions like this to make things clear, and in the case of Argentina they’ve defined it as “three or more”, which a “good enough” definition of what a “group” is.

EDIT: The document we’re discussing is publicly available, by the way. The “three or more” clause describes what is understood as a gathering for the purposes of exercising the right to protest, and the requirement is notifying the government 48 hours in advance that you intend to protest. There’s also an additional provision for spontaneous protest.

 

[jomaper]

Functionally speaking a single person on a plaza or park can be considered a protest. It’s not a function of how many, it’s a function of what is going on. The law features definitions like this to make things clear, and in the case of Argentina they’ve defined it as “three or more”, which as a good enough definition of what a “group” is.

EDIT: The document we’re discussing is publicly available, by the way. The “three or more” clause describes what is understood as a gathering for the purposes of exercising the right to protest, and the requirement is notifying the government 48 hours in advance that you intend to protest. There’s also an additional provision for spontaneous protest.

Yeah, very democratic having to ask for permission to protest in any way shape or form. I wonder how many will they approve.
I'm done with this thread lol. See you in a few months when this dude is fleeing the country with yet another show of how fucking stupid libertarianism is.