Google's CEO Berates Apple's Focus

[McHaggis]

The connector part is somehow flawed. Apple used the same 30pin for about 9 years its only a matter of time which they changed the connectors.

My point was that when they finally decided to change the connector, they chose a proprietay connector instead of the one the rest of the portable devices in the world have been using for almost as long. They chose lightning so they can make money on licensing from all the devices that make use of it, which is fair enough I suppose, but with 40bn in the bank they could have taken the hit so that the consumer benefits instead.

But that's the impression I get from Apple. I never really felt like they cared about their consumers.

 

[Arras]

Chrome is on the iOS App Store. I am using it now.

AFAIK it's not really Chrome though, it's more like a Safari reskin with some added features unrelated to rendering. I think all browsers have to use Safari under the hood or they won't be allowed on the app store.

 

[Jamstruth]

This issue is about how too much of a competitive nature is harmful. Take the iOS6 maps move. Apple was so fixated on one-upping Google that not only did they remove Google Maps from iOS's default apps, they removed it from the App store so that users couldn't install it anyways. That's some heavy competition. And you know what? It hurt them. Apple is STILL getting ridiculed for how bad the iOS6 maps app is, and it's caused them headaches.

Google Maps was never IN the App Store to begin with! It was built into the system. So it acts a bit weird. I don't even know if Google built the Maps app for iOS or not.

Google Maps was not "removed" it was never there.

 

[Thanatos Telos]

It wasn't on the App store originally because it was preinstalled yeah, but after it was removed from iOS Google wanted to submit it to the App store (like they apparently did with youtube).
http://www.phonesreview.co.uk/2012/11/19/google-maps-app-for-ios-ready-to-submit/
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2012/11/17/google_ios_mapping_app_submission/

But it never made it through. Same type of reason Chrome isn't on there, Apple doesn't allow directly-competing apps. (Things like Opera Mini get on there because Opera Mini's technically a remote app, Opera's servers render the page and send the image and link data to you.)

What are you saying? Chrome and Maps are both on the app store. Chrome's been there for months and Maps was released last night.

 

[nando]

What are you saying? Chrome and Maps are both on the app store. Chrome's been there for months and Maps was released last night.

you are not understanding how evil apple is. they want you to think that the maps are there but they aren't. and as a gentleman pointed out before, thats not really chrome, it is safari made to look like chrome, just like all the other browsers in the app store. and non of those other map apps are real neither, apple rejects all competition.

 

[Thanatos Telos]

you are not understanding how evil apple is. they want you to think that the maps are there but they aren't. and as a gentleman pointed out before, thats not really chrome, it is safari made to look like chrome, just like all the other browsers in the app store. and non of those other map apps are real neither, apple rejects all competition.

If it were like safari, it would have Nitro. Your argument is similar to me saying "Every Windows program(excepting games) has the same border." To add on, have you even done a bit of research on the new GMaps app?

 

[Rydian]

Google Maps is now on the App Store.

Yup, looks like it happened during this thread. Talk about weird timing, some of the stuff I posted earlier is invalid by now.

Google Maps was not "removed" it was never there.

It was removed from iOS, and then blacklisted (right word I think?) on the app store, but it looks like that decision just got reversed last night (wouldn't be the first time Apple changed store decisions).

What are you saying? Chrome and Maps are both on the app store. Chrome's been there for months and Maps was released last night.

The "Chrome" in the App store is Safari's engine, skinned to look like Chrome, with Chrome bookmark and sign-in functionality.
http://www.slashgear.com/chrome-for-ios-hits-us-app-store-28236360/

Unlike other decisions Apple's made with the App store, I don't think the "no competing rendering engines" rule is going to be broken too soon. They've had to relax their stances on a lot of other content (guns and violent games, games with alcohol, etc.) to get more business in their app store (and sometimes to save a little face), but I don't see the competing-browser rule being pushed out, especially since people can't even tell when they're just using a re-skin (or, in the case of Opera Mini, a remote app) so they see "Chrome" and "Opera" in the app store and stop putting pressure on Apple since they think it's allowed already.

~

Can't help but notice you have yet to give a source for your statement about Google Maps getting kicked off iOS6 because of data mining.

Not like I'm surprised, though. You tend to show up in threads that mention Google and never show sources for the crazy shit I call you on anyways.

As I linked to you earlier, it's easy to see crazy rumors posted, and sites will republish rumors (to get views, or they think it's real too and want to warn people), but actually checking to see if something's true or not should take precedent.

 

[nando]

Can't help but notice you have yet to give a source for your statement about Google Maps getting kicked off iOS6 because of data mining.

hold on a second. my response was to you claiming that apple ditching google maps was the result of apple focusing on one-upping google. i claimed it was because google was not supporting maps on ios with the same features they were giving android and i provided a link for that. yet you have not provided an actual reference to the motivations being "one-upping, google"

and here is a report from newsweek making a mention of it

http://www.businessweek.com/articles/2012-10-03/mapping-a-path-out-of-steve-jobs-shadow#p2

"Jobs had come to loathe Google, which he felt was copying features of the iPhone while withholding a key feature of Google Maps that allows smartphones to dictate turn-by-turn directions aloud."

yes the mining is a little harder to find a reference for but it doesn't take a genious to realize that since the introduction of siri and the implementation of yelp, apple is now in the same business as google in gathering mining information. i provided a link about google wanting to implement ads into ios maps and google lattitude.

whether steve was right or wrong or crazy or stupid, doesn't matter. your claim that it was to one-up google holds no more water than my claim that it was to cut off google from data mining or because of lack of features.

http://www.imore.com/siri-google-killer-potential-gold

i didn't contest any of the other things you claimed, just that one and you didn't provide actual proof of motivation.


for the record. i like most of your posts and our opinions of these two companies doesn't change my opinion of you. i'm no out to attack you. but also stand in my shoes.

also don't paint me as a troll that busts in in every google article. i don't. i've read just about every one posted on here and i've commented on very few. i was even planning to stay out of this one as you can see i deleted my comment in the very first post right away. i don't go around arguing on the internets, i don't enjoy doing so and i'm not that guy

 

[Rydian]

"Well it'd be good for them if they were data mining, so obviously they were doing it" - Bullshit.

It'd be good for me if I murdered the president and stole his money, so that obviously means I did it, right? lolno

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478882
There, I specifically quoted the data mining line, and asked for source on that. I cut out the turn-by-turn stuff because I don't care about that, the data mining is what I was calling for a source on.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478901
And there, I asked for it again, by naming it specifically.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478923
And here I go into even more detail specifying that what I'm calling into question is your claim that Google got kicked off iOS for data mining.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4479006
And right there I point out that none of your "sources" actually show the data mining or state it as an act or want in relation to Apple/iOS (so it's clear I'm talking about the data mining, not the turn-by-turn stuff).

If you can't find a source, that's because it's bullshit.

I pointed out earlier that just because somebody is being reported doesn't mean it's correct. People have reported false things about Google before, which is why I'm stressing to you the importance of proper sources for claims.

 

[nando]

"Well it'd be good for them if they were data mining, so obviously they were doing it" - Bullshit.

It'd be good for me if I murdered the president and stole his money, so that obviously means I did it, right? lolno

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478882
There, I specifically quoted the data mining line, and asked for source on that. I cut out the turn-by-turn stuff because I don't care about that, the data mining is what I was calling for a source on.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478901
And there, I asked for it again, by naming it specifically.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4478923
And here I go into even more detail specifying that what I'm calling into question is your claim that Google got kicked off iOS for data mining.

http://gbatemp.net/threads/googles-ceo-berates-apples-focus.339057/page-2#post-4479006
And right there I point out that none of your "sources" actually show the data mining or state it as an act or want in relation to Apple/iOS (so it's clear I'm talking about the data mining, not the turn-by-turn stuff).

If you can't find a source, that's because it's bullshit.

I pointed out earlier that just because somebody is being reported doesn't mean it's correct. People have reported false things about Google before, which is why I'm stressing to you the importance of proper sources for claims.

fine shame on me. put me out on the town square and point your finger. now show me yours. where is the source of steve jobs saying "lets one up google and do our own maps"

 

[Thanatos Telos]

Yup, looks like it happened during this thread. Talk about weird timing, some of the stuff I posted earlier is invalid by now.

It was removed from iOS, and then blacklisted (right word I think?) on the app store, but it looks like that decision just got reversed last night (wouldn't be the first time Apple changed store decisions).

The "Chrome" in the App store is Safari's engine, skinned to look like Chrome, with Chrome bookmark and sign-in functionality.
http://www.slashgear.com/chrome-for-ios-hits-us-app-store-28236360/

Unlike other decisions Apple's made with the App store, I don't think the "no competing rendering engines" rule is going to be broken too soon. They've had to relax their stances on a lot of other content (guns and violent games, games with alcohol, etc.) to get more business in their app store (and sometimes to save a little face), but I don't see the competing-browser rule being pushed out, especially since people can't even tell when they're just using a re-skin (or, in the case of Opera Mini, a remote app) so they see "Chrome" and "Opera" in the app store and stop putting pressure on Apple since they think it's allowed already.

Can't help but notice you have yet to give a source for your statement about Google Maps getting kicked off iOS6 because of data mining.

Not like I'm surprised, though. You tend to show up in threads that mention Google and never show sources for the crazy shit I call you on anyways.

As I linked to you earlier, it's easy to see crazy rumors posted, and sites will republish rumors (to get views, or they think it's real too and want to warn people), but actually checking to see if something's true or not should take precedent.

The desktop version of Chrome also uses Webkit. (+Javascript v8)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome
See, same basic engine.
(Sorta like the Anvil and Havok engines in the Assassin's Creed series, they use different versions, but the same underlying code.)

 

[Rydian]

fine shame on me. put me out on the town square and point your finger. now show me yours. where is the source of steve jobs saying "lets one up google and do our own maps"

I never said Steve Jobs said that. In fact he was dead before iOS6 came out.

Give me a quote of what you want info on, instead of making up more crap.

 

[nando]

Take the iOS6 maps move. Apple was so fixated on one-upping Google that not only did they remove Google Maps from iOS's default apps, they removed it from the App store so that users couldn't install it anyways.

 

[Rydian]

The desktop version of Chrome also uses Webkit. (+Javascript v8)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Google_Chrome
See, same basic engine.

Just like Maxthon using the IE7 engine on XP is the same thing as IE5 on Windows 95, right? Nope.

I KNOW that Safari and Chrome use the same product as their base engine, but that doesn't mean it's the same version or program (Chrome tends to be ahead in the development), and the rendering engine is only part of it, Chrome's Javascript engine is a huge thing (well, WAS a huge thing when it came out, and in fact caused Firefox to make a new one too), but that's not on iOS either.

Safari and Chrome are both using different versions of the same rendering engine.
But chrome on iOS is using Safari, which is different. It's not Chrome, it's Safari with some addons.

You might want to read up on these topics.
"Webkit" - The rendering engine.
"Trident" - IE's rendering engine, but it's often used by other browsers like Maxthon and Avant, so it's a good example of the same concept.
"V8" - Chrome's javascript engine.
"Spidermonkey" - Firefox's javascript engine, for a comparison (and timeline).

 

[Thanatos Telos]

I never said Steve Jobs said that. In fact he was dead before iOS6 came out.

Give me a quote of what you want info on, instead of making up more crap.

I don't like nando's system of going sourceless, but this might help.
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ple-boss-left-plans-4-years-new-products.html
(Just saying, chances are he had nothing to do with software.)

 

[Rydian]

~

(Damn forum won't let me grab that).

Anyways... SERIOUSLY, DUDE? IT'S THE FOCUS OF THIS DAMN TOPIC.

http://www.dailytech.com/article.aspx?newsid=29394

 

[nando]

forget it

 

[Rydian]

Back on topic...

I wonder if Google's Maps app is actually Google Maps, or if it's, say, a reskin of Safari that jumps right to their online maps site with a specific interface? XD

 

[chris888222]

Back on topic...

I wonder if Google's Maps app is actually Google Maps, or if it's, say, a reskin of Safari that jumps right to their online maps site with a specific interface? XD

I have no idea how relevant this info is but...

http://www.redmondpie.com/google-ma...lopers-bypass-apple-maps-in-third-party-apps/

No surprise. Apple openly admitted how horrible their maps were anyway.
At least Tim did.

 

[Rydian]

I have no idea how relevant this info is but...

http://www.redmondpie.com/google-ma...lopers-bypass-apple-maps-in-third-party-apps/

No surprise. Apple openly admitted how horrible their maps were anyway.
At least Tim did.

the Google Maps SDK allows developers to access a custom-built URL scheme

Sounds like it is just pulling the browser data somehow.