Nobody who complains about NFL players taking a knee during the anthem stands up for it at home

[PuNKeMoN]

Players taking a knee instead of rising for the national anthem as a form of protest is brilliant. It is non-violent, it reaches a massive audience, and it symbolizes what the founders of the USA intended. The action is seen by many as unpatriotic. In the spirit of revolution I disagree and counter that it is the most patriotic action they could take, as peaceful protest is granted in the US constitution.
Another concern is how they are using celebrity status and expressing views that conflict or are not necessarily in accordance with the organization, their employer, while on company time. That should not matter, as it it is a right to protest, and there is no law implicitly stating that every US citizen absolutely must stand for the national anthem. People who are angered by players taking a knee during the anthem do not rise from their easychair at home when the anthem plays. I find the hypocrisy appalling.

The protest is against police violence. It is the police's job to enforce laws. It is not their job to interpret laws and carry out punishment. Those who attempt to stifle such a protest and those who promote the suppression of this protest are allowing fascism to propagate in the guise of patriotism.

 

[Clydefrosch]

it shouldn't even just be police brutality, because in addition to killing an obscene amount of black people in the most cowadly ways possible, they're also somehow not arresting an obscene amount of white people who manage to end the life of a black person (also true for neo nazis and other white nationalists killing non-white nationalists).

 

[JellyPerson]

Racist white people are a plague tbh
But you know, they should keep their opinions to themselves rather than killing everyone they hate
that's just senseless

 

[raystriker]

I feel they could protest in a better forum, instead of disrespecting the flag.

 

[PuNKeMoN]

it shouldn't even just be police brutality, because in addition to killing an obscene amount of black people in the most cowadly ways possible, they're also somehow not arresting an obscene amount of white people who manage to end the life of a black person (also true for neo nazis and other white nationalists killing non-white nationalists).

Oh the issues run much deeper than police brutality. The fact that a corporation (now legally having the rights of an individual, wtf is that nonsense?) can penalize an employee for taking advantage of their constitutional right to protest an issue which is clearly effecting a large populous sets a dangerous precedent.
US citizens need to move forward with caution, it seems as though we are an enemy to corporate entities.

I feel they could protest in a better forum, instead of disrespecting the flag.

See title and get back to me after some critical thought.

 

[kuwanger]

I feel they could protest in a better forum, instead of disrespecting the flag.

The most respectful way to treat the US flag is to protest when it is being raised to support positions that are antithetical to the spirit of America. This includes things like forcing people to stand and respect it. I don't care what you do to a physical object like a flag. I do care how you treat the people around you and how you accord yourself in your actions in government.

 

[lordkaos]

i don't get it, shouldn't kneeling before the flag be seen as a more respectful gesture than standing up?

 

[Clydefrosch]

i don't get it, shouldn't kneeling before the flag be a more respectful gesture than standing up?

its a bit complicated.
on the one hand, kneeling is historically a sign of respect. but it's also a sign of submission. the flag is no symbol that demands respect or submission by force, the way it is currently demanded by president racism and his party of crooks.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

Black men account for half of all murders in the US despite making up a tenth of the population. There’s a reason they get killed so much

do you mean half of all murders are committed by black men (which sounds farfetched) and that this is a good reason to kill them just to be on the safe side?
that sounds incredible racist to me.

 

[lordkaos]

its a bit complicated.
on the one hand, kneeling is historically a sign of respect. but it's also a sign of submission. the flag is no symbol that demands respect or submission by force, the way it is currently demanded by president racism and his party of crooks.

if people are going to demand respect to the flag by force then maybe all people should start kneeling instead.

 

[Joe88]

do you mean half of all murders are committed by black men (which sounds farfetched) and that this is a good reason to kill them just to be on the safe side?
that sounds incredible racist to me.

1980-2008 https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/htus8008.pdf
and another 2003-2011 https://www.bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/hus11.pdf

Alot of it is gang violence/ black on black murders which the media will completely ignore

 

[Deleted User]

Police act on gut feeling. I cannot believe how many people honestly believe that it is fair to judge what a police officer did when you don't have his background, or training, or experience, or limited knowledge of the situation. After the fact, we can all see that the man did not have a gun, but could the police officer? He misjudged the situation, nothing more, nothing less. By taking a magnifying glass to an issue that the police officer only had a 1x zoom on does not a fair case make.

Am I saying that all police violence is just misjudged situations? Absolutely not. I know that there are police officers who will abuse their power, I have seen it. Does that mean that all police officers abuse their power? Absolutely not. The media chooses to comment on things that will produce an outrage.

About the kneeling, I have mixed feelings. I don't believe they are actually doing it for a cause except attention. On the other hand, they may be doing it for a cause and I am being quick to judge, and on the third hand they should have chosen a different method. I just don't know what to think and I definitely don't need you telling me that I don't stand for it at home, because I am not stupid enough to watch mind-numbing sports like football.

 

[kuwanger]

"Males represented 77% of homicide victims and nearly 90% of offenders."

I guess by SwitchMiiWii's logic, we should expect all males to suffer police brutality without complaint.

In all seriousness, if the issue is black-on-black violence (which seems to be the case with the stats), then the issue is a police presence that mitigates this. Adding to this is not the answer.

Police act on gut feeling. I cannot believe how many people honestly believe that it is fair to judge what a police officer did when you don't have his background, or training, or experience, or limited knowledge of the situation. After the fact, we can all see that the man did not have a gun, but could the police officer? He misjudged the situation, nothing more, nothing less. By taking a magnifying glass to an issue that the police officer only had a 1x zoom on does not a fair case make.

Read the above. The only way we can have a stronger police presence in areas where criminals are acting without sufficient repudiation is if the police are not so good at "act on on gut feeling". Yes, this sadly means more police will be killed by criminals than would otherwise. But a system in which the police see everyone as a criminal and are so prime to kill the innocent because there are so many guilty is one in which no one wants to go to the police for help. That's precisely the foundation of a system that cannot work to actual solve the crime problem.

About the kneeling, I have mixed feelings. I don't believe they are actually doing it for a cause except attention. On the other hand, they may be doing it for a cause and I am being quick to judge, and on the third hand they should have chosen a different method.

I have little doubt that some do it for attention. Most people who stand for the flag do it for attention, not because of some profound respect for the principles the flag stands for. If that was your chief concern, we should stop en masse doing these flag standing, national anthem singing engagements. They are much more disingenuous than a few sports stars aggrandizing a kneel in protest.

 

[GhostLatte]

Racist white people are a plague tbh
But you know, they should keep their opinions to themselves rather than killing everyone they hate
that's just senseless

Rascist any type of people are a plague.

 

[SG854]

"Males represented 77% of homicide victims and nearly 90% of offenders."

I guess by SwitchMiiWii's logic, we should expect all males to suffer police brutality without complaint.

In all seriousness, if the issue is black-on-black violence (which seems to be the case with the stats), then the issue is a police presence that mitigates this. Adding to this is not the answer.



Read the above. The only way we can have a stronger police presence in areas where criminals are acting without sufficient repudiation is if the police are not so good at "act on on gut feeling". Yes, this sadly means more police will be killed by criminals than would otherwise. But a system in which the police see everyone as a criminal and are so prime to kill the innocent because there are so many guilty is one in which no one wants to go to the police for help. That's precisely the foundation of a system that cannot work to actual solve the crime problem.



I have little doubt that some do it for attention. Most people who stand for the flag do it for attention, not because of some profound respect for the principles the flag stands for. If that was your chief concern, we should stop en masse doing these flag standing, national anthem singing engagements. They are much more disingenuous than a few sports stars aggrandizing a kneel in protest.

Yup, majority of victims are Male. Cops target and kill Men more then Women. If people complain about Racism against Blacks, then they have to complain about Sexism against Men. And that Cops are sexist against men. If they don't then they are contradictory.

People say well men deserve it because they are inherently more violent. Well if men deserve getting shot for being more violent, then you also have to accept that blacks are shot because they are more violent and not because of racism. You know because black men are shot more then black women. So the explanation for this gender discrepancy then is not because of racism but because they are more violent.

If you accept racism as actually the issue, then you have to accept that being inherently more violent is not the issue, and the reason black men are shot more than black women is because of racism and sexism. If you see people protesting racism against blacks, and forming protest marches for blacks, and not form big protest marches against sexism for men, because they say sexism against men is not a thing, then they are contradictory and I wouldn't take what the say seriously.

Tl;DR So if you believe Cops are Racist against and Oppressing Blacks, then you also have to accept they are Sexist and Oppressing Men, and accept that Male Oppression in society is systemic. If you don't you are contradicting yourself.

 

[Kioku]

Players taking a knee instead of rising for the national anthem as a form of protest is brilliant. It is non-violent, it reaches a massive audience, and it symbolizes what the founders of the USA intended. The action is seen by many as unpatriotic. In the spirit of revolution I disagree and counter that it is the most patriotic action they could take, as peaceful protest is granted in the US constitution.
Another concern is how they are using celebrity status and expressing views that conflict or are not necessarily in accordance with the organization, their employer, while on company time. That should not matter, as it it is a right to protest, and there is no law implicitly stating that every US citizen absolutely must stand for the national anthem. People who are angered by players taking a knee during the anthem do not rise from their easychair at home when the anthem plays. I find the hypocrisy appalling.

The protest is against police violence. It is the police's job to enforce laws. It is not their job to interpret laws and carry out punishment. Those who attempt to stifle such a protest and those who promote the suppression of this protest are allowing fascism to propagate in the guise of patriotism.

The protest is an asinine move that only irritates those who served the country and believe in the flag symbolically. Kneeling for the flag isn't protesting. It's disobedience and arrogance. Also, how do you know nobody stands for it at home? Do you personally visit every home? No? Then shut up.

 

[Navonod]

At home it's your castle your rules. I get the argument here but it's as week as kneeling during the national anthem to protest police brutality.
You guys always ignore the facts. Black people kill more black people than white people do and cops kill more whites than blacks. Cut the crap with victim hood. It's getting old.

 

[dpad_5678]

I feel they could protest in a better forum, instead of disrespecting the flag.

No matter WHAT we do to protest, there's something wrong with it.
Burning cars? *OMG THE LEFT IS VIOLENT*
Literally bending our leg? *OMG THE LEFT IS DISRESPECTFUL*

There's nothing wrong with kneeling, and the only people that DO MANAGE to find something wrong with it are just easily triggered conservatives that feel like everyone should be required to wear a MAGA hat and attend a daily Trump ass-kissing rally.

they are Sexist and Oppressing Men

That "the minorities are the oppressors" victim card though, bahahahaha!

 

[GhostLatte]

No matter WHAT we do to protest, there's something wrong with it.
Burning cars? *OMG THE LEFT IS VIOLENT*
Literally bending our leg? *OMG THE LEFT IS DISRESPECTFUL*

There's nothing wrong with kneeling, and the only people that DO MANAGE to find something wrong with it are just easily triggered conservatives that feel like everyone should be required to wear a MAGA hat and attend a daily Trump ass-kissing rally.


That "the minorities are the oppressors" victim card though, bahahahaha!

Burning cars is very violent.

 

[SG854]

No matter WHAT we do to protest, there's something wrong with it.
Burning cars? *OMG THE LEFT IS VIOLENT*
Literally bending our leg? *OMG THE LEFT IS DISRESPECTFUL*

There's nothing wrong with kneeling, and the only people that DO MANAGE to find something wrong with it are just easily triggered conservatives that feel like everyone should be required to wear a MAGA hat and attend a daily Trump ass-kissing rally.


That "the minorities are the oppressors" victim card though, bahahahaha!

What? Did you read what I typed?
I was talking about Cops.
I'm guessing you just breezed through what I said and just wanna hear what you wanna hear.

Well in this case Cops are the minority so ya.
So of you believe Cop Racism against blacks, then you have to accept a minority (cops) is targeting a group bigger then them (Blacks).

 

[Monado_III]

The protest is an asinine move that only irritates those who served the country and believe in the flag symbolically. Kneeling for the flag isn't protesting. It's disobedience and arrogance. Also, how do you know nobody stands for it at home? Do you personally visit every home? No? Then shut up.

I don't get this, everyone and anyone who serves a western country (in the military) should know that they are protecting the freedoms and rights of their country, including everyone's right to peacefully protest whatever the heck they want. If they get mad at people exercising their rights (that they fought for) they probably aren't very patriotic themselves. In fact they should be proud of people protesting as they live in and fought for one of the relatively few countries where you can protest and not get killed/thrown in jail for it (ie Tiananmen Square 1989).