"PS4" announced at Playstation Meeting 2013

[Guild McCommunist]

Please don't strawman. I wasn't saying they should put a woman there just because of her gender, I was saying they should have a woman there because of her talent, drive, accomplishments, etc. AND her gender. I don't know whether you're trying to tell me that it's *impossible* to find one such person from all those companies...or? My assumption is that it was possible to find at least one, but Sony didn't make the effort to do it for this particular event they're hosting. If Microsoft host a similar event for their xbox, and they can have at least one female team member for the presentation because they're willing to go the extra mile in order to find one, I'd lay the blame squarely at Sony's feet.

I don't blame Sony for the 'industry problem', like I said, everyone just sort of ended up there 'by default'. The point I think you're missing is this is a PR issue. Judging from their intro, Sony did want to attract a wider audience. It's a PR oversight to not go the extra mile at this PR event; if they had, they would've done a better job. But I'm optimistic that they'll learn something from this and be more mindful about their image for future events.

It's pretty fucking impossible.

Also why are you bringing up this criticism now compared to thousands of conferences from all developers where they have no women?

This feels like some TumblrInAction shit.

 

[Foxi4]

It's pretty fucking impossible.

Also why are you bringing up this criticism now compared to thousands of conferences from all developers where they have no women?

This feels like some TumblrInAction shit.

Why did Nintendo call their brawler games "Super Smash Bros." when there are women in them? Sexism. Amma gonna sue.

 

[leic7]

It's pretty fucking impossible.

Also why are you bringing up this criticism now compared to thousands of conferences from all developers where they have no women?

This feels like some TumblrInAction shit.

It's really that bad, eh? lol and the reason I am only bringing this up now as opposed to before is because I've only recently become conscious about this whole gender representation issue. I couldn't have brought it up earlier simply because I wasn't aware there were no women at most other events, until now! You've gotta start somewhere, don't you? As the video game industry begins to mature, so have I, I guess.

 

[Deleted_171835]

Multiplats of last generation.
WiiU hardly will be able to keep having the same multiplats PS4 and next-gen Xbox will have.

Eh, no. The Wii U features a GPU with DirectX 11 features that's about twice as powerful than the 360's GPU. Unlike the Wii, it's completely feasible to port over a game on traditional "next-gen" consoles to the Wii U. It doesn't have radically different architectures (like the Wii) nor is the power-gap as huge. Yes, there will be downgrades in geometry, textures and what not but it'll still be essentially the same game (think PC low vs. high).

The difference is that this time, it has more to do with whether third-parties will bother bringing their game to the Wii U and if they feel they can recoup the costs of porting. It's not a matter of can't anymore.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

It's really that bad, eh? lol and the reason I am only bringing this up now as opposed to before is because I've only recently become conscious about this whole gender representation issue. I couldn't have brought it up earlier simply because I wasn't aware there were no women at most other events, until now! You've gotta start somewhere, don't you? As the video game industry begins to mature, so have I, I guess.

Well it's kinda like complaining about almost all prominent Magic the Gathering players being male. Not much you can do about that.

And, well, Sony is starting somewhere by funding that aforementioned scholarship for women interested in game design.

 

[KingVamp]

Why did Nintendo call their brawler games "Super Smash Bros." when there are women in them? Sexism. Amma gonna sue.

Lady Palutena has already beaten you to the petition.

 

[mysticwaterfall]

Multiplats of last generation.
WiiU hardly will be able to keep having the same multiplats PS4 and next-gen Xbox will have.

Agree with Soulx, but also should mention that the Wii U has at least one PS4 game confirmed coming to it in watch dogs. Which Ubisoft said would be "the same experience".

 

[Gahars]

Please don't strawman. I wasn't saying they should put a woman there just because of her gender, I was saying they should have a woman there because of her talent, drive, accomplishments, etc. AND her gender.

Yeah, you say that, but at the end of the day, it's still a distinction made on the basis of that developers gender. I'm not strawmanning, I'm responding to exactly what you are proposing.

I don't know whether you're trying to tell me that it's *impossible* to find one such person from all those companies...or?

I don't know whether you're telling me you didn't read my post all the way through...or?

My assumption is that it was possible to find at least one, but Sony didn't make the effort to do it for this particular event they're hosting.

That's a pretty fucking huge leap to make with absolutely no evidence whatsoever, especially when (as we've already established), Sony has a history of being mindful on the subject.

If Microsoft host a similar event for their xbox, and they can have at least one female team member for the presentation because they're willing to go the extra mile in order to find one, I'd lay the blame squarely at Sony's feet.

Or maybe Microsoft could be shoving someone onstage to take advantage of the easy publicity. Maybe, you know, there's more to this than baseless assumptions can address? I know, I know, crazy thought there, but chew on it for a bit.

I don't blame Sony for the 'industry problem', like I said, everyone just sort of ended up there 'by default'. The point I think you're missing is this is a PR issue. Judging from their intro, Sony did want to attract a wider audience. It's a PR oversight to not go the extra mile at this PR event; if they had, they would've done a better job. But I'm optimistic that they'll learn something from this and be more mindful about their image for future events.

It's a "PR Issue" because people are nitpicking over nothing, or rather, looking for a way to be offended/slighted/etc. without taking the time to address the root problem. It's making a mountain out of a molehill while Mt. Everest looms over you.

I don't know, I just wonder where these armchair crusaders were when, let's say, Nintendo had their last Direct... or the one before that... or for most of the conferences at E3... at any E3, for that matter. Any takers?

 

[Deleted_171835]

Why did Nintendo call their brawler games "Super Smash Bros." when there are women in them? Sexism. Amma gonna sue.

That's nothing. Nintendo has shown rampant sexism since the 80s with the Game Boy brand. What, girls don't play games too?

 

[Gahars]

That's nothing. Nintendo has shown rampant sexism since the 80s with the Game Boy brand. What, girls don't play games too?

And Nintendo, what if you don't fit into society's binary gender construct?

Check your CIS-privilege, shitnerds!

 

[Guild McCommunist]

That's nothing. Nintendo has shown rampant sexism since the 80s with the Game Boy brand. What, girls don't play games too?

In fairness I would call it genius Nintendo marketing to avoid getting it confused with Gamer Chicks.

Warning: Worst shit on the net. Not NSFW, just you may die inside.

 

[Mantis41]

Agree with Soulx, but also should mention that the Wii U has at least one PS4 game confirmed coming to it in watch dogs. Which Ubisoft said would be "the same experience".

I think you're mistaking this. Ubisoft nearly didn't release the WiiU version. They are now saying it will be the same experience as the 360 and PS3 releases. This has nothing to do with next gen consoles and whether the WiiU will be able to keep up in a few years time.

 

[mysticwaterfall]

I think you're mistaking this. Ubisoft nearly didn't release the WiiU version. They are now saying it will be the same experience as the 360 and PS3 releases. This has nothing to do with next gen consoles and whether the WiiU will be able to keep up in a few years time.

And they say the PS3 experience will be the same as the PS4 (presumably, with slightly less graphics, no share, etc)
"So the same experience is there on the PS3 and other consoles. Players will have the same enjoyment; they will not feel any letdown."

http://m.kotaku.com/5986057/hey-wat...-first-instance-of-ps4-multiplayer-last-night

So yeah, it doesn't prove anything about the future in years to come. But as I said before, I don't think all this power amounts to much of a practical difference, so it won't be a matter of having to totally redo something like on the Wii. Now will, publishers want to? That's a different story, like soulx said.

 

[Mantis41]

And they say the PS3 experience will be the same as the PS4 (presumably, with slightly less graphics, no share, etc)
"So the same experience is there on the PS3 and other consoles. Players will have the same enjoyment; they will not feel any letdown."

http://m.kotaku.com/5986057/hey-wat...-first-instance-of-ps4-multiplayer-last-night

So yeah, it doesn't prove anything about the future in years to come. But as I said before, I don't think all this power amounts to much of a practical difference, so it won't be a matter of having to totally redo something like on the Wii. Now will, publishers want to? That's a different story, like soulx said.

It's kind of like saying the MW3 experience was the same on the Wii as other platforms. Most of the content was probably there but compared to others it was ugly as hell. Unfortunately this is where I see WiiU comparisons in 2 or 3 years time.

 

[Guild McCommunist]

It's kind of like saying the MW3 experience was the same on the Wii as other platforms. Most of the content was probably there but compared to others it was ugly as hell. Unfortunately this is where I see WiiU comparisons in 2 or 3 years time.

Technically it had less people for multiplayer, no voice chat, no map packs, and I'm not even sure if they kept the survival mode.

 

[mysticwaterfall]

It's kind of like saying the MW3 experience was the same on the Wii as other platforms. Most of the content was probably there but compared to others it was ugly as hell. Unfortunately this is where I see WiiU comparisons in 2 or 3 years time.

I don't think Activision ever said it would be the same though, and nobody was expecting it to be. Granted, Ubisoft has lied to us lately about other stuff *cough*Rayman*cough*

 

[leic7]

Yeah, you say that, but at the end of the day, it's still a distinction made on the basis of that developers gender. I'm not strawmanning, I'm responding to exactly what you are proposing.



I don't know whether you're telling me you didn't read my post all the way through...or?



That's a pretty fucking huge leap to make with absolutely no evidence whatsoever, especially when (as we've already established), Sony has a history of being mindful on the subject.



Or maybe Microsoft could be shoving someone onstage to take advantage of the easy publicity. Maybe, you know, there's more to this than baseless assumptions can address? I know, I know, crazy thought there, but chew on it for a bit.



It's a "PR Issue" because people are nitpicking over nothing, or rather, looking for a way to be offended/slighted/etc. without taking the time to address the root problem. It's making a mountain out of a molehill while Mt. Everest looms over you.

I don't know, I just wonder where these armchair crusaders were when, let's say, Nintendo had their last Direct... or the one before that... or for most of the conferences at E3... at any E3, for that matter. Any takers?

ah, ok, I do make a distinction for gender against a backdrop of the severe under-representation of one gender and over-representation of another gender at this event. If a woman is qualified for the role, and all other equally qualified candidates are men, I would choose the woman to do the presentation. Is that what you have an issue with?

The gaming community is going through a transition, more and more people are starting to question things about this culture that they've taken for granted before, and I guess that's part of the reason why so many people seem to suddenly converge at the realization that there is a problem with looking like an exclusive boys club. Yes, the problem has been there forever, but they didn't see it before, and now they finally see it. This is actually a very positive thing. Sony has inadvertently played an instrumental role in kickstarting an awareness campaign/movement for change in the community. It's beautiful.

I did read your entire post, but I couldn't figure out if you meant finding a woman from those teams who is qualified enough to present a video game is a (near) impossibility, therefore no one could have possibly done it. My reasoning goes something like this: If you meant it's possible, not "easy", but possible if they make an effort, then the fact that there's no woman on stage would mean they didn't really make an effort, right? But if you meant it's simply impossible or near impossible, then how come the Microsoft folk thinks they can find a few members for their products, despite being in the same male-dominated industry as Sony?

It might be "easy publicity" for Microsoft if they showcase more diversity at their event (we'll see about that) than Sony did, but I wouldn't call the people asking for the same level of PR performance from Sony "looking for a way to be offended". People just have higher expectations now.

 

[Foxi4]

Technically it had less people for multiplayer, no voice chat, no map packs, and I'm not even sure if they kept the survival mode.

No, no, no - it did have Voice Chat. It's just that nobody on the planet owns a Wii Speak add-on.

ah, ok, I do make a distinction for gender against a backdrop of the severe under-representation of one gender and over-representation of another gender at this event. If a woman is qualified for the role, and all other equally qualified candidates are men, I would choose the woman to do the presentation. Is that what you have an issue with?

I don't think you know what sexism is. If you categorize the candidates on the basis of their gender and choose a female candidate not because of her higher qualifications but because she's a woman, that's sexism. Similarily, chosing a black presenter just because he's black to appease the coloured audiences is racism.

If you want to be fair, you don't choose a presenter because of his/her gender, colour of skin or any other characteristic features outside of their qualifications for the job.

Problems like these are usually solved by this fun thing called "Job Interview" - it's a late 20th century invention - you round up people with similar qualifications and ask questions, you might've heard about it at some point.

 

[VMM]

Eh, no. The Wii U features a GPU with DirectX 11 features that's about twice as powerful than the 360's GPU. Unlike the Wii, it's completely feasible to port over a game on traditional "next-gen" consoles to the Wii U. It doesn't have radically different architectures (like the Wii) nor is the power-gap as huge. Yes, there will be downgrades in geometry, textures and what not but it'll still be essentially the same game (think PC low vs. high).

The difference is that this time, it has more to do with whether third-parties will bother bringing their game to the Wii U and if they feel they can recoup the costs of porting. It's not a matter of can't anymore.

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?
WiiU will feature the same CPU architecture as Wii, a IBM PPC,
while PS4 uses a Jaguar x86_64, they're completely different.

Porting to WiiU will be just as painful for developers as porting to Wii.

It's not just a matter of possibility only,
it has much more to do with it's been financially feasible.
Is it worth to spend time and money porting a game to WiiU?
Let the developers answer this.
My bet is it will be a second Wii in third party support,
with few ports from Capcom, Activision and Ubisoft.

 

[Mantis41]

Do you have any idea what you're talking about?
WiiU will feature the same CPU architecture as Wii, a IBM PPC,
while PS4 uses a Jaguar x86_64, they're completely different.

Porting to WiiU will be just as painful for developers as porting to Wii.

It's not just a matter of possibility only,
it has much more to do with it's been financially feasible.
Is it worth to spend time and money porting a game to WiiU?
Let the developers answer this.
My bet is it will be a second Wii in third party support,
with few ports from Capcom, Activision and Ubisoft.

Doesn't the 360 have a 3 (6) core IBM PPC?