The situation in Ukraine...

[pustal]

>Implying that citizens *shouldn’t* be armed

The Ukraine is a poster child for citizens responsibly utilising firearms against foreign aggressors right now. An armed society is a polite society - the fact that most European countries deprived their citizens of the right to bear arms is a modern tragedy. Hopefully events like this will show the utility of allowing citizens to own and operate firearms for the purposes of self-defense.

An armed society is whatever it is depending on the circumstances. Somalia isn't a polite society although armed, Switzerland is. The Netherlands have got a low armed society and is, and also has Myanmar and has an ongoing genocide. Give them guns and the majority will murder the minority faster.

Switzerland and the Netherlands have heavy gun control. The first allows and incites people to keep their service guns, but provides a great level of gun education and psychological evaluation, not to mention keeping a registry, while the Netherlands opt for a disarmed society.

 

[KuntilanakMerah]

Russian will kick Nato and ukraine a$$, russia defending their honor and the border of their region

 

[pustal]

Russian will kick Nato and ukraine a$$, russia defending their honor and the border of their region

When someone defends a border, usually they are on their side of the border...

When they are not, it's called an invasion.

Also there is no honor to defend when you target civilians or arresting children for laying flowers.

That's not Russia defending Russia's honor, is Russian government defending Putin's coward ass.

Though it is a sign of madness when you are more afraid of a child with a flower than nuclear warhead.

Also old women:


Can you taste the glory in that? Can you tell me he is doing that for the Russian's people honor? Do you have the Russian people in so low shameful regard? Do their feelings need to be protected from the children and the elderly aside from the Ukrainian bogeyman that didn't touch them or didn't want to have anything to do with them?

And if you are so confident on their kicking anyone else's ass, why do they need to use thermobaric, cluster and vacuum bombs? That's not kicking someone's ass, that's rage turning the table because the game wasn't going as planned.

Wanna see honest Russian strength and character? I'll show you real Russian strength and character in the brave soldiers that go against oders, sabotage their own offensive and turn to the side the witness to be in the right. Those are some of the real heroes, alongside the Russians that protest at home, independently of their own age a physical condition, even if they are a 77 elder. My respect to them. My disgust to Putin.

 

[KingVamp]

Polite society, just ignore all the mass shootings.

 

[Viri]

Can someone tell me why Russia is so damn scared of Ukraine joining NATO, when Russia can end all life on Earth if they felt like it?

 

[Reiten]

Can someone tell me why Russia is so damn scared of Ukraine joining NATO, when Russia can end all life on Earth if they felt like it?

It's probably more of an excuses then actual fear. From a more sober standpoint, it would diminish their influence in the country and make meddling in Ukraine a lot more troublesome and risky.
I mean if the goal was to limit NATO influence in Ukraine they could have easily done it diplomatically in at least 2 ways:

• Ukraine joins the NATO, but a contract is signed that prevents the stationing of NATO troops and hardware in Ukraine;
• Ukraine doesn't enter the NATO, but a contract gets signed that allows for protection in case that Russian troops cross the boarder;

 

[Foxi4]

An armed society is whatever it is depending on the circumstances. Somalia isn't a polite society although armed, Switzerland is. The Netherlands have got a low armed society and is, and also has Myanmar and has an ongoing genocide. Give them guns and the majority will murder the minority faster.

Switzerland and the Netherlands have heavy gun control. The first allows and incites people to keep their service guns, but provides a great level of gun education and psychological evaluation, not to mention keeping a registry, while the Netherlands opt for a disarmed society.

I like how you’re comparing an impoverished country in the middle of Africa that’s ruled by pirates and warlords that came to power after over 20 years of civil war to a normal western democracy pretending that these are somehow equivalent. Average citizens in Somalia aren’t armed, the “bad guys” are - rule of law is non-existent, so you can’t argue civil society. The same can be said about Myanmar, former Burma. For the record, with “possible genocide” looming over my head I would 100% feel safer and more secure with an AK47 rather than without, but hey, let’s both make bad faith arguments pretending that democratic states are equivalent to literal Mad Max “states”. Yeah, you’re right - the “circumstances” sure are different - reductio ad absurdum would like to have a word with you.

Polite society, just ignore all the mass shootings.

Cost of freedom. Besides, how many school shootings is Switzerland dealing with? Before you answer, the murder rate is near zero. Perhaps there are other factors that lead to school shootings that are completely unrelated to gun ownership, and maybe you should blame those rather than basic civil rights, like the right to self-defense?

 

[Dark Ronin]

I like how you’re comparing an impoverished country in the middle of Africa that’s ruled by pirates and warlords that came to power after over 20 years of civil war to a normal western democracy pretending that these are somehow equivalent. Average citizens in Somalia aren’t armed, the “bad guys” are - rule of law is non-existent, so you can’t argue civil society. The same can be said about Myanmar, former Burma. For the record, with “possible genocide” looming over my head I would 100% feel safer and more secure with an AK47 rather than without, but hey, let’s both make bad faith arguments pretending that democratic states are equivalent to literal Mad Max “states”. Yeah, you’re right - the “circumstances” sure are different - reductio ad absurdum would like to have a word with you.
Cost of freedom. Besides, how many school shootings is Switzerland dealing with? Before you answer, the murder rate is near zero. Perhaps there are other factors that lead to school shootings that are completely unrelated to gun ownership, and maybe you should blame those rather than basic civil rights, like the right to self-defense?

So you think it's OK to giveaway AK's to any man willing to have one, even if he is insane and psychopath? Polite society my a$$.
And I sure as hell bet that you've never encountered gunfire yourself, not even once facing its lethality.

 

[Foxi4]

That's just a bad reading of a gigantic situation in a narrow light of tiny little political flag.

I can come up with something like that for any day to day political view of mine, just like that:

"Ukrainians civilians found an easier route of escape by train rather than by car, while Russian army are exploiting the Ukraine's road system for the sake of their invasion. So this war should teach us to halt investments in cars and invest in trains."

This whole mess should teach us nothing but to being more human and tolerate imperialism less, or not at all. Our domestic little political demands should be treated domestically.

An armed society is significantly more difficult to conquer by an aggressor, I don’t see why this is somehow a “shocking” or “overly simplified” stance - history shows us countless examples of that being true. Russian troops are in a whale of a pickle now learning the same lesson American troops learned in places like Fallujah - firearms in the hands of citizens turn every situation tense. Whenever a soldier opens the door, there’s a non-zero chance that there’ll be a barrel of a weapon on the other side waiting for them, whether it’s a military or non-military structure. I fully understand the comfort of leaving things up to the government overlords, but that’s an argument you can comfortably make from a distance, not when there are armored vehicles outside of your window. Given an option to choose whether I’d like to be armed or unarmed in an active warzone, I’m going to pick armed 10 out of 10 times - that’s the sensible answer, if not for country then at least for my own personal safety.

So you think it's OK to giveaway AK's to any man willing to have one, even if he is insane and psychopath? Polite society my a$$.
And I sure as hell bet that you've never encountered gunfire yourself, not even once facing its lethality.

They should have the right to own them regardless - the government wouldn’t have to rely on volunteers if it didn’t seize privately owned weapons in the first place. For the record, I’m Polish - after many years of Soviet occupation I have no love for the Russian military. Maybe Putin and his cronies wouldn’t be getting embarrassed by completely untrained combatants right now if they kept their noses out of the business of other sovereign nations. Hate to break it to you, but the days of great Mother Russia are over - the country has a smaller GDP than the state of Texas. The western powers don’t even need to get involved too much - they could outspend Russia into oblivion, as they have with the Soviet Union. Giant on clay legs, Putin learned all the wrong lessons after his illustrious KGB career in a totalitarian state that ran on genocide, and he didn’t learn any new tricks after the regime change. The Russian people don’t want this - they want to progress past the mistakes of the 20th century. They want to join the 21st century with their western neighbours, and Putin is feeling the brunt of that sentiment in Russia right now - that’s why he’s arresting those who have the guts to protest this unwarranted invasion.

 

[Viri]

I hope Ukraine gets their own "Second Amendment" after this is all done and over with.

 

[Foxi4]

I hope Ukraine gets their own "Second Amendment" after this is all done and over with.

I doubt that very much, but the thousands of volunteers will forever be remembered as heroes, as they should be. I’m simply pointing out a factor that nobody seems to account for - right now the lines between civilian and enemy combatant are blurred in Ukraine, and that’s part of the reason why Russian troops are getting swatted like flies. The second reason is that they expected to be in and out, so they’re grossly unprepared in terms of food and shelter. The lucky ones get to sleep in armored carriers, and they’re all looting local stores in order to obtain scraps of food. They were told the citizenry will welcome them as liberators - what they saw instead was the citizenry opening fire on them. Quite demoralising - no wonder a lot of them are deserting, in spite of overwhelmingly superior firepower. Now, whether people are comfortable with it or not, those are facts.

 

[pustal]

I like how you’re comparing an impoverished country in the middle of Africa that’s ruled by pirates and warlords that came to power after over 20 years of civil war to a normal western democracy pretending that these are somehow equivalent. Average citizens in Somalia aren’t armed, the “bad guys” are - rule of law is non-existent, so you can’t argue civil society. The same can be said about Myanmar, former Burma. For the record, with “possible genocide” looming over my head I would 100% feel safer and more secure with an AK47 rather than without, but hey, let’s both make bad faith arguments pretending that democratic states are equivalent to literal Mad Max “states”. Yeah, you’re right - the “circumstances” sure are different - reductio ad absurdum would like to have a word with you.
Cost of freedom. Besides, how many school shootings is Switzerland dealing with? Before you answer, the murder rate is near zero. Perhaps there are other factors that lead to school shootings that are completely unrelated to gun ownership, and maybe you should blame those rather than basic civil rights, like the right to self-defense?

No, school shootings are related to ease access of guns including military grade guns without any kind of regulation and mental evaluation.

China had a lot of school attacks, but because public gun ownership is unexistent, victims were in the units. Guns in the hands of those kids would be a multiplier to the tragedy.

In Switzerland there are no gun incidents because people are highly military trained before, strictly evaluated and gun ownership is closely controlled.

But fine, you don't want Somalia as an example, have the US. High, undescriminated and unevaluated gun ownership give you militias and the insurrection you had last year, school shootings to a ridiculous frequency, gun related crime and incients through the roof and police fear to do their job.

You are paranoid that your democratically ellect government will come after you and you'll need the guns to defend against what? The most powerful army on the planet? The most overequiped police force? To the point that paranoia almost threw down the democratic part of that government.

 

[Foxi4]

No, school shootings are related to ease access of guns including military grade guns without any kind of regulation and mental evaluation.

China had a lot of school attacks, but because public gun ownership is unexistent, victims were in the units. Guns in the hands of those kids would be a multiplier to the tragedy.

In Switzerland there are no gun incidents because people are highly military trained before, strictly evaluated and gun ownership is closely controlled.

But fine, you don't want Somalia as an example, have the US. High, undescriminated and unevaluated gun ownership give you militias and the insurrection you had last year, school shootings to a ridiculous frequency, gun related crime and incients through the roof and police fear to do their job.

You are paranoid that your democratically ellect government will come after you and you'll need the guns to defend against what? The most powerful army on the planet? The most overequiped police force? To the point that paranoia almost threw down the democratic part of that government.

I’ve already addressed this point in the post you’re quoting. No school shootings in Switzerland. Chalk it up to training all you want - I’m not opposed to training, I’m opposed to restrictions on basic civil rights. If a little training is your idea of sensible gun control then we’re in agreement and there’s nothing to argue about. Seems to me that other factors are at play. I *can* imagine why school shootings were prevalent in China though, considering it’s a totalitarian nightmare which, until 5 minutes ago, heavily restricted reproductive rights of its citizens which led to the emergence of the “tiger mom” phenomenon and an unreasonable “Asian style” pursuit of success. Chinese children are under an immense amount of stress for no reason - without looking at any statistics at all I’m willing to wager they snap all the time, from suicide through domestic violence, to more public displays of aggression. If there’s one kind of kid I wouldn’t want to be, it’s a kid in the Chinese school system, under the watchful eye of overbearing parents.

EDIT: Besides, your “training” argument falls apart when you account for the fact that many mass shootings in the U.S. are committed by *former servicemen* with years of training under their belt, along with extensive psych evaluation which somehow doesn’t pick up on the extensive PTSD springing from the U.S. military complex getting involved in conflicts it has no business getting involved in. Are those the “circumstances” you mentioned, or are we still going to pretend we don’t understand the saying I quoted?

 

[pustal]

I’ve already addressed this point in the post you’re quoting. No school shootings in Switzerland. Chalk it up to training all you want - I’m not opposed to training, I’m opposed to restrictions on basic civil rights. If a little training is your idea of sensible hun control then we’re in agreement and there’s nothing to argue about. Seems to me that other factors are at play. I *can* imagine why school shootings were prevalent in China though, considering it’s a totalitarian nightmare which, until 5 minutes ago, heavily restricted reproductive rights of its citizens which led to the emergence of the “tiger mom” phenomenon and an unreasonable “Asian style” pursuit of success. Chinese children are under an immense amount of stress for no reason - without looking at any statistics at all I’m willing to wager they snap all the time, from suicide to domestic violence, to more public displays of aggression.

EDIT: Besides, your “training” argument falls apart when you account for the fact that many mass shootings in the U.S. are committed by *former servicemen* with years of training under their belt, along with extensive psych evaluation which somehow doesn’t pick up on the extensive PTSD springing from the U.S. military complex getting involved in conflicts it has no business getting involved in.

Read all I wrote there and before. Switzerland: training and regulation. You need a military certification to have a gun that, amount other things certified you are trained and mentally fit to possess a gun. Furthermore the guns you own have to be registered and so any ammo that you buy that is serialized. You can't go out and buy any military grade weapons as well. You need a permit and a good justification too purchase some weapons.

The problem with the US isn't that people can have guns, is that people can have guns without due diligence because "freedom". And because of that, as you claimed above, it doesn't make people any more polite.

As for your veterans, listen to them. They complain the lack of health treatment after their service and psych evaluations mean nothing if outdated. Nothing stops them from developing PTSD and go buy a gun.

 

[AlanGreen]

When someone defends a border, usually they are on their side of the border...

When they are not, it's called an invasion.

Also there is no honor to defend when you target civilians or arresting children for laying flowers.

That's not Russia defending Russia's honor, is Russian government defending Putin's coward ass.

Though it is a sign of madness when you are more afraid of a child with a flower than nuclear warhead.

Also old women:


Can you taste the glory in that? Can you tell me he is doing that for the Russian's people honor? Do you have the Russian people in so low shameful regard? Do their feelings need to be protected from the children and the elderly aside from the Ukrainian bogeyman that didn't touch them or didn't want to have anything to do with them?

And if you are so confident on their kicking anyone else's ass, why do they need to use thermobaric, cluster and vacuum bombs? That's not kicking someone's ass, that's rage turning the table because the game wasn't going as planned.

Wanna see honest Russian strength and character? I'll show you real Russian strength and character in the brave soldiers that go against oders, sabotage their own offensive and turn to the side the witness to be in the right. Those are some of the real heroes, alongside the Russians that protest at home, independently of their own age a physical condition, even if they are a 77 elder. My respect to them. My disgust to Putin.


It is very scary and strange that the fate of so many people depends on one crazy ruler. It is very scary when people who have money and power decide the fate of people. It is especially scary when people get rich as a result of their crimes. I recently read several articles about human trafficking, more info here. It is an incredible cruelty in the 21st century to human trafficking. It is an incredible happiness that Ukraine is a democratic and free country without these phenomena.

What is happening in Russia is horrible and immoral.

 

[sailr]

My assessment of the situation in Ukraine is like that in a song
Прожитых под светом Звезды
По имени Солнце.
И две тысячи лет - война,
Война без особых причин.
Война - дело молодых,
Лекарство против морщин.
Красная, красная кровь -
Через час уже просто земля,
Через два на ней цветы и трава,
Через три она снова жива
И согрета лучами Звезды
По имени Солнце.
----name:【звезда по имени солнце】 singer:Виктор Цой
Unfortunately, I don't know the English lyrics of this song
(I only know his Chinese)
You can find it on YouTube

 

[Foxi4]

Read all I wrote there and before. Switzerland: training and regulation. You need a military certification to have a gun that, amount other things certified you are trained and mentally fit to possess a gun. Furthermore the guns you own have to be registered and so any ammo that you buy that is serialized. You can't go out and buy any military grade weapons as well. You need a permit and a good justification too purchase some weapons.

The problem with the US isn't that people can have guns, is that people can have guns without due diligence because "freedom". And because of that, as you claimed above, it doesn't make people any more polite.

As for your veterans, listen to them. They complain the lack of health treatment after their service and psych evaluations mean nothing if outdated. Nothing stops them from developing PTSD and go buy a gun.

So you are going to pretend not to understand. Not really the subject of the thread, so I won’t indulge you, but a prerequisite to having a polite society is to have a civil society in the first place. You coming up with examples like Somalia makes you look foolish, that’s all I have to say on the matter.

For the record, gun regulation in Switzerland is among the most lax in the entire world - ownership is almost completely unregulated. There is no license required to own arms, regardless of whether you are a citizen or a foreigner. Only acquisition is regulated via shall-issue permits, which do not apply to a wide variety of weapons. I don’t know exactly how you imagine this works, but you could take a flight to Switzerland right now and, in all likelihood, purchase a rifle without too much trouble and with no permanent residence. Citizen service is unrelated to gun control, it has to do with preparedness, if anything.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Firearms_regulation_in_Switzerland

 

[Xzi]

Russian will kick Nato and ukraine a$$, russia defending their honor and the border of their region

You know Putin is desperate when he's paying the troll farms for propaganda posts and likes on GBAtemp.

 

[Foxi4]

You know Putin is desperate when he's paying the troll farms for propaganda posts and likes on GBAtemp.

It’s actually a phenomenon we noticed a long time ago, and something we pay close attention to. We apply specific rules to such members, there’s a sticky in this forum for a reason.

https://gbatemp.net/threads/political-disinformation-propaganda-ops-infiltrating-gbatemp-too.593080/

Disinfo and propaganda isn’t anything new online - we’re quite familiar with bad actors and routinely remove them if they’re found to be here exclusively in bad faith.

 

[djpannda]

You know Putin is desperate when he's paying the troll farms for propaganda posts and likes on GBAtemp.

It’s actually a phenomenon we noticed a long time ago, and something we pay close attention to. We apply specific rules to such members, there’s a sticky in this forum for a reason.

https://gbatemp.net/threads/political-disinformation-propaganda-ops-infiltrating-gbatemp-too.593080/

Disinfo and propaganda isn’t anything new online - we’re quite familiar with bad actors and routinely remove them if they’re found to be here exclusively in bad faith.

in other words

Costello​

- their registration and content IP address match suspicious russian VPNs and host names, or other
- they relay exclusively Russian-backed propaganda/narrative
- they rely on the same tactics as other disinformation bots found on Facebook, Twitter and other social media



Yea Kermlin has been trying to Run the Long Con but Half the world was in denial