Why does this matter? Honest question.
It's not like he's making any money from this. What personal gain does he get from more people using it?
It's not like he's making any money from this. What personal gain does he get from more people using it?
6.Removing the disc check would mean that people with dead drives would be able to play GC games.
7.Removing the AP means that we will be able to play compressed GC games. This would be really useful considering that some games are really small and use only a small part of the disc. For instance, some games only have about 200 MB of data, so why force us to keep their isos in uncompressed forms, meaning that they will instead have a size of 1.3 GB (so they will contain useless data for the most part)?
8.People who lost or gave away their GC discs would be able to play their games
9.The same goes for people with scratched discs
10.We would be able to load modded games
11.We would be able to load other regions' versions of our games without having to import. This would be great for European people who want to play NTSC games, as that would give them many advantages (ie: being able to run games at 60 FPS rather than 50, at a higher resolution, and with interlaced video).
12.People would be able to play games that are no longer obtainable due to not being sold (and since those games aren't obtainable anymore, those people wouldn't have been able to pay money for them anyway, so it's not like their makers would have gained any money either way)
13.GC games are no longer produced and sold anyway. Buying a GC game these days means that you're buying a second-hand game, so it's not like their makers would make any money anyway.
14.Why use Devolution with its AP when DM serves the same purpose and doesn't have AP?
15.No need to wear out the Wii's drive producing clean rips for Devolution
16.People with newer Wiis that don't have GC compatibility and spit out GC discs would be able to play GC games using Devolution (after it gets updated to support Wiimotes and Classic Controllers)
17.It would be easy to move games between HDDs or partitions. With the AP, you have to re-validate every single game if you moved or copied your games folder to another HD or partition (or if you formated your partition).
18.People who already have dumps of GC games will not need to redundantly re-rip them in order to produce clean rips that Devolution would accept.
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I'm going to be honest, I would honestly pay to have Four Swords Adventures COOP back!
Think about it...
Meaning...
EDIT: Enough of my optimism, I do agree with the post above. There were 8 new posts while I was making this image based on an old poster from RacketBoy. lol
EDIT: About 14, as Devolution becomes updated, the Wii hardware will be compatible, such as Wii Remotes, but those are all VERY good reasons to remove the AP.
Think about it...
Meaning...
EDIT: Enough of my optimism, I do agree with the post above. There were 8 new posts while I was making this image based on an old poster from RacketBoy. lol
EDIT: About 14, as Devolution becomes updated, the Wii hardware will be compatible, such as Wii Remotes, but those are all VERY good reasons to remove the AP.
Devolution is a great application, maybe not the greatest piece of software on the scene but it is a very nice addition thanks to Tueidj.
After reading for a while I understand most of arguments people brought to the forum and most of what they said are valid points but at the same time the whole discussion is pointless.
Why:
1. The author made it clear since very long ago when this project was a concept that he understood his application may be used for piracy therefore he added AP to it. He didn't do it to prevent piracy on GC games, he did it to prevent piracy through his application solely.
2. This application is given free to anyone therefore demands don't have any place here.
3. Argumentation/flaming etc here won't make the author change his mind on what he did.
The bottom line is that Devolution wasn't developed to be the Ultimate Solution to anything. It is a very nice application that many people with the appropriate resources will enjoy while others may not do very well due to the way the application was created.
In my humble opinion if you feel Devolution will give you many headaches then avoid/restrain yourself from using it. There are other options out there that do the job very nicely.
After reading for a while I understand most of arguments people brought to the forum and most of what they said are valid points but at the same time the whole discussion is pointless.
Why:
1. The author made it clear since very long ago when this project was a concept that he understood his application may be used for piracy therefore he added AP to it. He didn't do it to prevent piracy on GC games, he did it to prevent piracy through his application solely.
2. This application is given free to anyone therefore demands don't have any place here.
3. Argumentation/flaming etc here won't make the author change his mind on what he did.
The bottom line is that Devolution wasn't developed to be the Ultimate Solution to anything. It is a very nice application that many people with the appropriate resources will enjoy while others may not do very well due to the way the application was created.
In my humble opinion if you feel Devolution will give you many headaches then avoid/restrain yourself from using it. There are other options out there that do the job very nicely.
'Cause the world's not black and white.
It's entirely possible to make something you think it cool and interesting that some people will find helpful, without violating your morals to make it appeal to a broader audience.
Look around you, look up, and look down. What do you see? People requiring instant gratification. People who want a perfect life who have nothing but high expectations. A life filled with greed (and relative to the scene) gives nothing in return. All of this applies exponentially to "the scenes."
Sometimes part of me wished that Tueidj released this to:
Show that it can be done.
Remind people how pathetically greedy they are for wanting a perfect life and accepts nothing less.
It's obvious I'm reaching a state of inebriation and should back away from the computer before making any posts. Tueidj did what he did because it's his program and he can do whatever he wants with it.
Sometimes part of me wished that Tueidj released this to:
Show that it can be done.
Remind people how pathetically greedy they are for wanting a perfect life and accepts nothing less.
It's obvious I'm reaching a state of inebriation and should back away from the computer before making any posts. Tueidj did what he did because it's his program and he can do whatever he wants with it.
D
Dork
Guest
People will still complain. Devolution is the first GC loader without having to install a completely re-written MIOS, which is extremely convenient especially if you want to keep cMIOS and have your GC homebrew related apps working. And because it has AP measures, the demand for a loader without AP will increase, which will probably lead to a cracked Devolution. Not that I am supporting piracy or not, just giving my two cents here.
Challenge ? Technical interest ? Proud to be be the first releasing a GC "emulator" in Wii mode ?
Your opinion is biased by the fact you seem to think all devs are releasing stuff to make "their" users happy.
Truth is they aren't, for most of them, they are doing it for themselves, coding is generally a very selfish hobby and public release does not necessarily mean he wants his work to please everybody, just that he wants everybody to see his work
At this point in the Gamecube's life cycle, it is difficult to find sufficient justification for anti-piracy measures. Practically no GC games are currently available at retail, so there is no weight to the argument that developers will not be compensated for their work. Any revenue generated at this point will only occur in the used market. The only rationale seems to be ideological at its base.
There is also an important distinction to be made between what is legal and what is ethical. Just because certain laws are in place in no way justifies that such laws are reasonable or ethical. Further, there is a lot of room for criticism of intellectual property laws, particularly where old software is concerned. I would argue that copyright should only hold for a short time - perhaps as short as five years - before IP goes into the public domain. This move would actually serve to promote ingenuity by allowing others to freely build upon past work. The IP laws presently in place are largely a result of lobbying by media conglomerates that have greedily swayed courts to extend IP protections far longer than justifiable, all to ensure a well over a lifetime of profit - life plus 70 years is absurd.
Finally, I have personally found that Devolution’s AP does not work properly. It will not recognize a clean 1:1 rip of Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader. So, as if often the case, once again AP measures have served to stop rightful owners from playing their legitimately purchased games.
There is also an important distinction to be made between what is legal and what is ethical. Just because certain laws are in place in no way justifies that such laws are reasonable or ethical. Further, there is a lot of room for criticism of intellectual property laws, particularly where old software is concerned. I would argue that copyright should only hold for a short time - perhaps as short as five years - before IP goes into the public domain. This move would actually serve to promote ingenuity by allowing others to freely build upon past work. The IP laws presently in place are largely a result of lobbying by media conglomerates that have greedily swayed courts to extend IP protections far longer than justifiable, all to ensure a well over a lifetime of profit - life plus 70 years is absurd.
Finally, I have personally found that Devolution’s AP does not work properly. It will not recognize a clean 1:1 rip of Star Wars Rogue Squadron II: Rogue Leader. So, as if often the case, once again AP measures have served to stop rightful owners from playing their legitimately purchased games.
Your quite right, people will still complain however it was clearly stated from the beginning how it would be done and how it would work and weather people like it or not this is how things are going to be managed so it's either adapt to it or walk into another direction.
Because console hackers and homebrew developers have a long history of getting monumentally butthurt over something or another and quitting the scene forever, to the dismay of people who wanted to use whatever they were developing. It's usually (A) their work being used for something they don't like or (B) public criticism.
We have B in abundance and we will probably have A in a while. What the author will do remains to be seen.
I know for a fact some people were trying to hush up discussion in the original Devolution thread for this reason, but the mods may just be trying to keep the main thread focused.
Keeping the main thread is on topic is fine.... and as long as people remain civil, this thread should be fine too.
D
Dork
Guest
Unless of course this topic dwells into methods on how to crack Devolution, then this thread will suffer the same fate as the other AP discussion thread.
Even modified isos (ex. undubs) are useless on Devolution due to non-existant original discs.
For example Tales of Symphonia undub can't be verified on Devolution even if you got the original USA discs.
For example Tales of Symphonia undub can't be verified on Devolution even if you got the original USA discs.
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Exactly, if tueidj decides to remove the AP, alright. If he won't, alright. His application, his choice. Giving reasons to remove it is okay, but actually making attempts at cracking it is just rude.
I think Tueidj is an amazing programmer. He did what Nintendo couldn't, AP. That and the whole GC USB loading w.o altering the MIOS.
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Anti-piracy makes legitimate users suffer, especially the discs they have are scratched or missing. Not to mention the author doesn't seem to give a s**t about those who have newer Wii consoles without gamecube compatibility or with broken drives. The only reason I want to use this is to play games with audio streaming, the others I can use Dios Mios to run. If history has proven anything, restrictive measures (like online DRM) are imposed only to have them decrypted shortly after.
If tueidj releases a version which supports newer no-GC Wiis, the AP scheme will have to change. Perhaps at that point it may be removed....
My major criticism is that Devolution's AP fails to authenticate a clean, genuine, GC disc (Rogue Leader). IMO, the worst failure of anti-piracy attempts is when they stop legitimate users. For the few games which require it, the audio streaming is great....
My major criticism is that Devolution's AP fails to authenticate a clean, genuine, GC disc (Rogue Leader). IMO, the worst failure of anti-piracy attempts is when they stop legitimate users. For the few games which require it, the audio streaming is great....
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