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Dispute over (now) 8-year-old son's transition to a girl

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FAST6191

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You know fine well that word in the trans community is considered as bad as the N word. You also know fine well that that word is used by transphobic idiots to hurt trans people. You also know that that word is acceptable when describing transistors in a radio or the ramps of a skateboard or part of a car ect.

So why would you even bring this up is beyond me other than to stir up more shit in this thread. Especially when it's a word that is banned from being used on the site

You tell me it is the case, and some seem to back it up for at least some. I go looking though at historical usages, the path to some deeming it a derogatory epithet, and some contemporary usages, and a different picture gets painted. There is also the option to "reclaim" the word if indeed it has fallen into disfavour so the future is open as well.

The site rules are immaterial in this particular aspect of discussion as well. Easy enough to play to them however if letter combinations might cause someone to pop an artery or something.
 

AmandaRose

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Screenshot_20200905_030402.jpg
 
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UltraSUPRA

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AmandaRose

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If I said that the word 'cis' is a hateful word aimed at normal people, what would you do?

That argument is hilarious how many times has someone been called a ugly cis or told to go die you cis bastard ect ect. Never is the answer now replace cis with the T word and the trans community hears comments like the above all the time.

Even yourself said in a post deleted in this very thread that we were all supposedly ugly you even used the t word then replaced it with all *****
 

UltraSUPRA

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That argument is hilarious how many times has someone been called a ugly cis or told to go die you cis bastard ect ect. Never is the answer now replace cis with the T word and the trans community hears comments like the above all the time.

Even yourself said in a post deleted in this very thread that we were all supposedly ugly you even used the t word then replaced it with all *****
I've never seen anyone online holding up a sign saying that they're outright afraid of you people.
 

AmandaRose

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I've never seen anyone online holding up a sign saying that they're outright afraid of you people.
Oh I wonder why we have such a fear of
cisgenders. This might clear it up for you

According to the 2015 U.S. Transgender Survey:

Nearly half (46%) of respondents were verbally harassed in the past year because of being transgender.
Nearly one in ten (9%) respondents were physically attacked in the past year because of being transgender.
Nearly half (47%) of respondents were sexually assaulted at some point in their lifetime and one in ten (10%) were sexually assaulted in the past year. In communities of color, these numbers are higher: 53% of Black respondents were sexually assaulted in their lifetime and 13% were sexually assaulted in the last year.
72% of respondents who have done sex work, 65% of respondents who have experienced homelessness, and 61% of respondents with disabilities reported being sexually assaulted in their lifetime.
More than half (54%) experienced some form of intimate partner violence, including acts involving coercive control and physical harm.
 
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FAST6191

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That argument is hilarious how many times has someone been called a ugly cis or told to go die you cis bastard ect ect.

I would usually see it combined to become "cis het" and in that case could drum up a fair few occasions of people being excluded, or seeking they be excluded, on that basis. Usually by morons that don't know what it is to have a conversation*, write a book with fictional characters, act in a film/tv show/play. Some might say it in jest as well but some also seem to imagine there is no such thing as jest, or maybe at least there is but being as there is but a chance that someone hears it and comes over all unnecessary or something that even that should be verboten.

*we then immediately have to have a lines drawing discussion -- is trans trans or should FTM have no bearing on MTF discussions and vice versa. Very different experiences from what I can see. I would however say that is pointless and lived experience, whilst useful, matters little in the face of abstract logic and empathy.

Water off a duck's back as far as I am concerned, a policy I advocate everybody adopt vis a vis words, but that would be answer to that question.
 

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That got us much further... *sarc* ;)

edit Not directed at the last posting but everything prior to that.

Confronting the 'word debate': I think Amanda Rose has a point here. The word is connected with all kinds of concepts and images, most of them seeminly stemming from societal prejudices, the Trans community wouldnt want to be associated with, if they had the choice. Trying to minimize its use seems fair.

'Taking it back' to reframe it also only works, if society at large stops using it with a different connotation.
 
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AmandaRose

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Indeed I do.
Well I'm glad you are consistent or consistently wrong in doing so depending on one's point of view but that is an argument for another day.

But the very fact I have been told on this very site to go kill myself ect or the worst one as I meantioned previously was when someone said they hoped my family die a horrible death in a fire simply because I am trans then the whole water of a ducks back thing os some what hard to do especially when you know what is going on with my mum as we have discussed in my status previously.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

So would you defend us white people if the word 'white' was used as a slur?
Why wouldn't I when I am white myself.
 
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FAST6191

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Well I'm glad you are consistent or consistently wrong in doing so depending on one's point of view but that is an argument for another day.

But the very fact I have been told on this very site to go kill myself ect or the worst one as I meantioned previously was when someone said they hoped my family die a horrible death in a fire simply because I am trans then the whole water of a ducks back thing os some what hard to do especially when you know what is going on with my mum as we have discussed in my status previously.

This is the internet. If you are not being told to kill yourself then it might be said that you are not in fact doing the internet.
Likewise I have had similar sentiments expressed towards me and mine.

Little dogs bark, and it is generally meaningless. Why you would internalise anything I am at a loss for.
 

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So would you defend us white people if the word 'white' was used as a slur?
If this becomes an argument for 'white people being excluded', cry me a river.. ;) This is a majority (or almost majority still), vs. an ultra minority argument.

Lets open up the analogy to radical feminism here. "But as a male I might be excluded from some of their meetings" might be correct, but you dont need a form of self pitty here - because, you - essentially - are barred access to a self help group and thats about it.

I've a - some would say derogative - image pretty vivid in my head currently (having 'visited' a liberal 'elites' online conference recently). And the image kind of looks like this: All the sessions that leaned heavily on feminism to make society more just - were lacking high level participants and people in there, usually werent amongst the brightest speakers. That I made that generalization, might be prejudice, but it was possible.

So in essence, leave them their self empowerment movements, even through you might be excluded, in the bigger context, none of that will ever be important. (People might make it to the higher national political level with that concept, but thats about it. In the space where ideas are king, no one is gonna deal with someone bringing a semantic crutch to an already liberal discussion.)
How fragile are you people if you need to make a rulebook for things that we can't say to people like you?
Beside the point. The word in question was coined and filled with imagery at a time, when the acceptance movement hadnt hit, and when it would have been used mostly derogatively. They got a chance at a fresh start (societal acceptance wise), and bringing up the catalyst for old concepts hurts that. Using the word isnt as 'verboten' as the N word in the societal concept, but hey - be a man and cut them some slack.
 
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Seliph

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How fragile are you people if you need to make a rulebook for things that we can't say to people like you?
There's no rulebook, it's just common sense to respect the existence of other people. The image was made for people who lack that understanding.
 
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RichardTheKing

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Wait until AFTER puberty (ideally wait until adulthood), the father shouldn't have to pay squat, and changing a son into a daughter is utterly disgusting.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------

The son needs to be taken from his abusive mother, and given to his father. Then the mother can be sued for child abuse.
 
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