Dispute over (now) 8-year-old son's transition to a girl

[Seliph]

Gender change is wrong and unnatural.

Gender change is awesome dude you should try it sometime.

 

[Deleted User]

Even people only reading clickbait ads know better:

6 surprising animals that can change sex
https://animalogic.ca/wild/6-surprising-animals-that-can-change-sex

If your truth is based on feels exclusively, and you find the need to still convince people using them, may I suggest you try religion.

Also, we all know, that this is how many people feel. Thats kind of the point for the campaigning.

That is COMPLETELY irrelevant, as these animals change their sex naturally, whereas people just chop off their penises and do other things to simulate the other gender. Besides, maybe this kid might have wanted children? With a "gender change", this poor child will never be able to have any children of his own.

 

[KingVamp]

I wonder how many people would change their sex, if it was easily changeable.


Also "unnatural". You mean like the internet you are using?

 

[notimp]

That is COMPLETELY irrelevant, as these animals change their sex naturally, whereas people just chop off their penises and do other things to simulate the other gender.

Let me get this straight, gender change is natural, when it happens naturally, but unnatural, if it does not happen naturally.

The same way as removing a rotten tooth you'd die from is natural, when it happens naturally, but unnatural, if it does not happen naturally?

Also. driving in a train is unnatural and would harm peoples minds, because humans werent meant to perceive that kind of speed, also was a popular argument in the day.

Heck, even the altar bread you'd consume at a mess is produced unnaturally these days.

If the argument is not about 'natures ethics' but about anything not natural being wrong because it wasnt meant to be, you couldnt live in a house, you couldnt press the lightswitch. And could I attend one of your ceremonies against breast implants please? Although, I couldnt fly over to where you are living to see it because it is unnatural. Nevermind streaming it. Work of the devil, I tell you.


edit: Also, on the semantics level: Something isnt ok, because it doesnt happen. So you shouldnt make it happen. Then put a word next to it that has the effect of making people feel wholesome and predetermined. With no extra logical argument attached to it. Its literally, it doesnt happen, so you shouldnt make it happen, because - word that makes you feel its predetermined.

You got to love religious arguing.

 

[omgcat]

I just see a bunch of people in here arguing about shit they have no academic knowledge of. Like a bunch of people here probably don't even have a BS let alone the MS you need to be a therapist or the PhD you need to be a prescribing psychiatrist. let other people worry about their personal medical choices, and leave the conversation to people who are actually educated on the topics and fields of study involved.

also maybe don't have a fit about calling someone by their preferred pronouns. It's not hard, and it does not detract from your freedom of speech.

 

[Deleted User]

Let me get this straight, gender change is natural, when it happens naturally, but unnatural, if it does not happen naturally.

The same way as removing a rotten tooth you'd die from is naturally, when it happens naturally, but unnatural, if it does not happen naturally?

Also. Driving in a train is unnatural and would harm peoples minds, because humans werent meant to percive that kind of speed, also was a popular argument in the day.

Heck, even the altar bread you'd consume at a mess is produced unnaturally these days.

If the argument is not about 'natures ethics' but about anything not natural being wrong because it wasnt meant to be, you couldnt live in a house, you couldnt press the lightswitch. And could I attend one of your ceremonies against breast implants please? Although, I couldnt fly over to where you are living to see it because it is unnatural. Nevermind streaming it. Work of the devil, I tell you.

Yes, but my point was that they shouldn't be doing this to this kid because he probably doesn't even know what any of this means. This process permanently prevents reproduction.

 

[notimp]

Yes, but my point was that they shouldn't be doing this to this kid because he probably doesn't even know what any of this means. This process permanently prevents reproduction.

Your point was what I described in the edit above:

edit: Also, on the semantics level: Something isnt ok, because it doesnt happen. So you shouldnt make it happen. Then put a word next to it that has the effect of making people feel wholesome and actions being predetermined. With no extra logical argument attached to it. Its literally, it doesnt happen, so you shouldnt make it happen, because - word that makes you feel its predetermined.

You've got to love religious arguing.

 

[Seliph]

This process permanently prevents reproduction.

It doesn't, actually. You don't have to have bottom surgery to be trans. The majority of trans-women actually keep their dicks. Anyways, bottom surgery can't be done on a person until they're an adult or have developed sufficiently enough. Like literally, you cannot do actual bottom surgery on an 8-year-old child. I don't really want to go into detail about this, but you straight up can't. It's not possible without botching the surgery.

 

[UltraDolphinRevolution]

Michael Jackson, a African-American did surgeries (and perhaps other things) to look more like a European American. Has he become one?

He did not ask people refer to him as such, I am just asking this to get the point across. Out of curtesy we might stop calling him African-American, but we all know he did not change his ethnicity.

 

[Deleted User]

Your point was what I described in the edit above:

edit: Also, on the semantics level: Something isnt ok, because it doesnt happen. So you shouldnt make it happen. Then put a word next to it that has the effect of making people feel wholesome and actions being predetermined. With no extra logical argument attached to it. Its literally, it doesnt happen, so you shouldnt make it happen, because - word that makes you feel its predetermined.

You've got to love religious arguing.

WTF does that even mean? Why is there a political forum on a gamer's website anyway? I was hoping to get away from all this political shit.

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It doesn't, actually. You don't have to have bottom surgery to be trans. The majority of trans-women actually keep their dicks. Anyways, bottom surgery can't be done on a person until they're an adult or have developed sufficiently enough. Like literally, you cannot do actual bottom surgery on an 8-year-old child. I don't really want to go into detail about this, but you straight up can't. It's not possible without botching the surgery.

Well, then, that just proves my point. If you have a penis and can sexually reproduce with women, then you are male. That's all there is to it.

 

[Seliph]

Well, then, that just proves my point. If you have a penis and can sexually reproduce with women, then you are male. That's all there is to it.

Lol I guess you've never heard of intersex people.

 

[UltraDolphinRevolution]

Lol I guess you've never heard of intersex people.

That is a different topic. The boy is male and - according to her mother - wants to become female.
Transgender is not transsexual/intersex. The former is the idea that you can change who you are based on feelings. The latter is an actual medical condition.

 

[Seliph]

That is a different topic. The boy is male and - according to her mother - wants to become female.
Transgender is not transsexual.

Of course it's relevant. I'm just giving @dwain12435 an example of people who aren't men who also have penises and are able to sexually reproduce with women. I'm refuting their point.

 

[lone_wolf323]

WTF does that even mean? Why is there a political forum on a gamer's website anyway? I was hoping to get away from all this political shit.

--------------------- MERGED ---------------------------


Well, then, that just proves my point. If you have a penis and can sexually reproduce with women, then you are male. That's all there is to it.

I dont understand why you are even in these forums here. You say you despise these but you continue to post in here. Its kinda.puzzling to what you have said.

 

[Deleted User]

That is a different topic. The boy is male and - according to her mother - wants to become female.
Transgender is not transsexual/intersex. The former is the idea that you can change who you are based on feelings. The latter is an actual medical condition.

The idea that you can change who you are based on feelings is stupid! I feel like Lebron James! Does that mean I am Lebron James? No! This is stupid!

 

[Seliph]

The idea that you can change who you are based on feelings is stupid!

Why not? For example, if you felt like a clown (which I'm sure you do often), wouldn't it make sense to become a clown based on those feelings if you so chose? Wouldn't that affirm your identity as a clown?

Just like clowns, gender is nothing but a transient social construct.

 

[Deleted User]

If

gender is nothing but a transient social construct.

, then why are people born as male and female instead of being born with a heap of moldable clay in place of their sex organs so that you can make their gender be whatever you want?

 

[Seliph]

If, then why are people born as male and female instead of being born with a heap of moldable clay in place of their sex organs so that you can make their gender be whatever you want?

1. There are a lot more things that factor into a person's sex than sex organs alone.
2. Again you clearly don't know what intersex people are.
3. Sex organs are basically "moldable clay", that's why some people get bottom surgeries to change their sex organs. Most of the human body can be reshaped like "moldable clay" anyways, it's not a concept exclusive to genitalia.
4. Gender is not the same thing as sex.
5. You ignored my sick burn, and I'm gonna be honest, that kind of hurt.

 

[notimp]

Michael Jackson, a African-American did surgeries (and perhaps other things) to look more like a European American. Has he become one?

For most of his album buyers actually, probably yes. He would have had much less cultural appeal at the time, if he hadn't. Which actually was probably what his label told his parents at one point.

Being loved by the public then became an obsession with the results we are familiar with.

Also we dont just have to limit that to changing physical properties.

Cosby show was famous for what you'd call cultural appropriation nowadays. And very successful.

The entire advertising industry, and much of capitalism is based on a principle, that image is reality.

Ever heard of facebook? You are happy, if people around you like you, right?

 

[Deleted User]

Just because you modify something to resemble something else, doesn't mean it has become something else. It merely resembles it.