Anime aren't cartoons?

[machomuu]

mthr, you make it seem like I don't even like DBZ in comparison

 

[KazoWAR]

Anime are cartoons, its more like a genre for cartoons in western countries I guess, but in japan, Dragonball Z and Sponge Bob Square Pants are both anime.

 

[machomuu]

Anime are cartoons, its more like a genre for cartoons in western countries I guess, but in japan, Dragonball Z and Sponge Bob Square Pants are both anime.
QUOTEI don't know how one can really assert what an anime is in comparison to cartoons due to the fact that there is no set definition for "anime" in the dictionary.

I know I said it only a few posts ago, but get my point. It's one of those things that there are no set definitions for and yet people tend to say what they are all of the time. In Japan, things that are considered anime are, well, anime. Same for cartoons here. Now, I can't say anything factually, but I'm pretty sure there's a definition in Japan that doesn't apply to the English language, likely vice versa for cartoons in Japan. So really, whether we call anime "cartoons" and vice versa (in Japan) would technically be wrong, but since there's no right the wrong is slightly void so there's no truth, and from there you can basically go off of what riposte said on post #164. Well, not until anime gets a definition, at least.

EDIT: While we're at it...is there a Japanese dictionary? I tried looking for Japan's definition of "cartoon", but as you can imagine...it's not easy. At all.

 

[KazoWAR]

I remember a few year back there where some foreign exchange students form japan touring our school. I was in a German class and our teacher arrange a thing where there went to our class and we talked about stuff. one girl who was an anime fan asked them the question "what anime do you like?" i guess she expected them all to be anime fans since they where japanese. but none of them really answered and then she then started naming off some anime to them but then the translator explained to us that in japan all cartoons are called anime and that it made no difference for if it was a Japanese cartoon or a American one.

 

[klim28]

I have a friend whos is an anime addict. And like other "otaku" whatever its called, whenever you say that anime=cartoon, they rage. haha. I say CatDog="whatever anime" and he enrages even more.

For me its the same. I don't know why they make a big deal out of it.

 

[machomuu]

I don't know why they make a big deal out of it.
There are 2 reasons for 2 different types of fans:
1. Being my case, is this:

Now that I've had a month to think about this topic, I have to say that I've seen and understood the "differences" people have listed from the start. However, I don't think those "differences" are really enough to consider cartoons and anime separate entities.

It's merely a cultural thing. Not in cultural thing in the sense of American vs. Japanese, but a cultural thing in the sense that people who are really into anime are going to have a stronger feeling that there is some inherent difference between the two while those who couldn't care less see some form of animation and consider it a cartoon.

Poor analogy:

Boxing vs. Kickboxing
"So you're a boxer?"
"No, I'm a kickboxer..."
"So then you box and you're allowed to kick?"
"Boxing and kickboxing are two separate sports..."
"I understand that boxing and kickboxing operate under different sanctioning bodies...but you're both essentially striking and counter-striking, right?"
"But we can throw punches AND kicks. Boxers can only throw punches..."
"I heard you the first time... So you're saying that you box and that kicks are allowed in your boxing matches?"
"We don't have boxing matches...we have KICKboxing matches... They are different."
"I give up."

2. Being the bandwagoner and very shallow way of thought is this:
QUOTE(Gahars @ Sep 11 2011, 01:55 PM)

Because that's the obvious implication; that using the word "cartoon" is somehow demeaning, and must be avoided at all costs.

 

[DroRox]

People who love anime just hate when it's called cartoons because cartoons resemble something childish.
But it seems to me that the whole debate is sort of pointless. Anime is still a form of animation from drawings, cartoon is the same. So why the whole debate? Because people don't want to be asociated with watching cartoons, so anime is a better name. That's how I see it...

 

[machomuu]

People who love anime just hate when it's called cartoons because cartoons resemble something childish.

People do often think that, but then there are cartoons like Family Guy, South Park, and heck, Avatar.

 

[darkangel5000]

Even though there are few exceptions, in my opinion anime have a deeper story than cartoons. Also, they're most likely not your average never-ending/ending without a real finale-Nicktoons.
Yeah, sure, on the one hand you've got batman and the likes, but then again most likely stuff like catdog or spongebob squarepants. So if one refers to an anime, I think it's the story-value that counts. That's the reason why I'd call Avatar - The last airbender an anime and PreCure not.

 

[machomuu]

Even though there are few exceptions, in my opinion anime have a deeper story than cartoons. Also, they're most likely not your average never-ending/ending without a real finale-Nicktoons.
Yeah, sure, on the one hand you've got batman and the likes, but then again most likely stuff like catdog or spongebob squarepants. So if one refers to an anime, I think it's the story-value that counts. That's the reason why I'd call Avatar - The last airbender an anime and PreCure not.

But then what do you consider shows like Azumanga Daioh, Crayon Shin-Chan, and...Pokemon? Cartoons?

 

[darkangel5000]

But then what do you consider shows like Azumanga Daioh, Crayon Shin-Chan, and...Pokemon? Cartoons?

Actually yes. Especially Crayon Shin-Chan.

 

[Vulpes Abnocto]

Thirteen pages in and people are still going back and forth about this?
I'm beginning to think that we might all have to agree to disagree and leave it at that.

 

[machomuu]

Thirteen pages in and people are still going back and forth about this?
I'm beginning to think that we might all have to agree to disagree and leave it at that.

I said that about a few pages back, it's not going to end on a good note, even after Densetsu and Old8oy made posts that should have been debate-enders.

 

[Gahars]

Seriously, I hate it when people use that definition, because there's really no truth to it. They are still both cartoons; calling either one a "cartoon" doesn't mean it's somehow inferior.

I'm going to keep using that definition. And who said anything about it being inferior?

Because that's the obvious implication; that using the word "cartoon" is somehow demeaning, and must be avoided at all costs.

Saying, "They're not cartoons, they're anime!" just comes off as pretentious and elitist.

Wow. Cartoon isn't demeaning at all. Umm, hello, ACME cartoons. Anything but bad. It's different art styles. Like I said, every Anime I've watched, has one big story. Fullmetal Alchemist, Dragonball Z (I find it has a better continuous story than Dragonball), Chobits just to name a few. And I compare them to what I see on TV, The Simpsons and all the other shows I listed don't have a continuous story. They make references sure, but it's not part of a story.

Hence the term implication; it's the message people send when they argue that eastern animation isn't in the same category as "cartoons".

And it seems like you're just stereotyping animation from two different regions based off of an incorrect assumption; not every piece of eastern animation is DBZ, Chobits, or Fullmetal Alchemist, and all American animation is not the Simpsons.

And going by style, that's like saying a novel written with sparse description and a novel written with purple prose are somehow not both novels, but belong in entirely different categorizations. Animation is the same way; different regions may animate with different styles, but in the end, they are both still animation, which makes them cartoons.

Cool story bro, my opinion still stands.

Wow, awesome debating skills buddy. It's fun when you can just ignore an argument and resort to, "It's my opinion!", the weakest excuse in the book. Good job!

And Machomuu, that's not a "shallow train of thought". Trying to create a distinction between "anime" and "cartoons" when none exists. When you say crap like that, even if you aren't pretentious or elitist, that's how you sound. Deal with it.

 

[machomuu]

And Machomuu, that's not a "shallow train of thought". Trying to create a distinction between "anime" and "cartoons" when none exists. When you say crap like that, even if you aren't pretentious or elitist, that's how you sound. Deal with it.

I never said that. I said that having the title of a cartoon imply that something is childish is shallow. I thought I was on your side there, but apparently not.

Even if not, don't know how that makes me sound elitist in the slightest. Or pretentious.

 

[Nujui]

Can we just end this.

 

[Gahars]

And Machomuu, that's not a "shallow train of thought". Trying to create a distinction between "anime" and "cartoons" when none exists. When you say crap like that, even if you aren't pretentious or elitist, that's how you sound. Deal with it.

I never said that. I said that having the title of a cartoon imply that something is childish is shallow. I thought I was on your side there, but apparently not.

Even if not, don't know how that makes me sound elitist in the slightest. Or pretentious.

Okay, my mistake. It seemed like you were saying what I was saying was the shallow train of thought; my bad, I misread it.

 

[machomuu]

Can we just end this.

I tried, riposte doesn't want it ended. That is why he left it open after all.

Of course, it makes sense. It's a forum, and as long as there is no "true answer" there will be debate.

EDIT: That's not to say I don't want it to end, though. This is rather circular, and circular debates bore me so.

 

[nythu123]

for the love of god theres a damn reason. you people are going on and on about a persons statement which is completely wrong.
Cartoon is considered fine art that has been animated into a funny scenario. Anime is made in Japan as their own cartoons with or without their own funny twist. Not only that, but Anime has more details into the animation as well as details to the characters and the plot.

Cartoons: spongbob, fairly odd parents, etc.

Anime: Naruto, Bleach, Gundam.

The lists, show the complete contrast between anime and cartoons.

-_-

 

[machomuu]

^That has been said a couple times already. That's the type of statement that leads to more circular arguments.

Of course, you know, hindsight and all that smosh. I really should have seen this coming and just PM'd Old instead of posting it here.

Is that what you wanted me to say, Feeny? I guess sorry is not enough to disintegrate the apathy you have for me that creates the bridge between you and I.