Covid-19 vaccine

[tabzer]

Seatbelts don't work if people don't use them. Vaccines don't prevent variants if people don't get vaccinated.


I didn't say anything about politics, but I don't think it's the political left that's putting themselves and those around them in harm's way just because they're butthurt their candidate is a big loser.

What I said from the beginning was based on the politics (promises, restrictions, mandates).
I even said politicians.

Vaccines can create variants for highly mutatable diseases. Maybe your 3x Covid 3x injection breeding ground created a couple variants itself.

 

[Lacius]

Vaccines can create variants for highly mutatable diseases. Maybe your 3x Covid 3x injection breeding ground created a couple variants itself.

This is just another one of your unsubstantiated conspiracy theories. The science is clear that the best way to reduce the odds of new variants popping up is to limit the spread of disease, which is accomplished by vaccinating as many people as possible.

What I said from the beginning was based on the politics (promises, restrictions, mandates).
I even said politicians.

Don't like masks, etc.? Get vaccinated, and get as many people to get vaccinated as possible.

 

[subcon959]

Have those peeps constantly focusing on sources not yet realised that anything that doesn't follow a certain narrative gets banned from (or would never be expressed in the first place on) the sites you would consider a credible source? There is a lot of BS on the uncensored sites yes, but they're also the only place left for alternative views to exist freely.

It's a lot more effective to confront the actual arguments if the goal is to end up with better information. Of course, that's unlikely to happen if everyone is entrenched and the only goal is to win.

 

[tabzer]

This is just another one of your unsubstantiated conspiracy theories. The science is clear that the best way to reduce the odds of new variants popping up is to limit the spread of disease, which is accomplished by vaccinating as many people as possible.

Yes, hosts with higher resistances are the places where mutations aren't incubated. It they do, it's because of a conspiracy.

If you got Covid 3x, it's you who is doing something wrong.

Don't like masks, etc.? Get vaccinated, and get as many people to get vaccinated as possible.

It's not that I don't like the current situation as much as it is that a promise of effectivity relies on people that aren't me, and cannot be reasonably expected to comply. It was a dead promise out of the gate and anybody who is reasonable would acknowledge it. That you would continue to spout such a meritless platitude makes me think you are just an outright shill. Are you Justin?

 

[RocaBOT]

Have those peeps constantly focusing on sources not yet realised that anything that doesn't follow a certain narrative gets banned from (or would never be expressed in the first place on) the sites you would consider a credible source? There is a lot of BS on the uncensored sites yes, but they're also the only place left for alternative views to exist freely.

It's a lot more effective to confront the actual arguments if the goal is to end up with better information. Of course, that's unlikely to happen if everyone is entrenched and the only goal is to win.

You cannot have an argument about "data" if you are not able to provide said data. To provide data, you need it to be public somewhere. That's what's commonly called a source

 

[zefyx]

The flu vaccine changes every year and its contents are determined by an educated guess as to which strains will be circulating that cycle. For that reason they don't always get it right, but it still confers a degree of protection and saves lives every year.

As for COVID there is no data showing that mutation by the virus will render the vaccines ineffective - corona viruses don't have the ability to mutate in the same way the flu does. The flu doesn't evolve naturally, rather it's simply shuffling around different components in animal hosts. So the flu is really several different viruses shuffling around their parts.

This didn't age well.

 

[subcon959]

You cannot have an argument about "data" if you are not able to provide said data. To provide data, you need it to be public somewhere. That's what's commonly called a source

I'd be pretty surprised if many people here are qualified to comment on actual raw data, instead of just relying on someone else's interpretation of it. Statistical analysis is as difficult as it is boring lol

 

[RocaBOT]

I'd be pretty surprised if many people here are qualified to comment on actual raw data, instead of just relying on someone else's interpretation of it. Statistical analysis is as difficult as it is boring lol

Yet people go around saying "data shows/suggests that vaccies have this and that dangerous side effect" but are unable to provide anything to substantiate the claim. If anyone's not able to show the data or an analysis of it that substantiates their claims, then their claims are most likely unfounded
Yes, data analysis is boring, but at least it's not annoying like debunking false claims that people get out of their asses is

 

[x65943]

This didn't age well.

To some extent, but also - the vaccines are still highly effective at preventing death and severe illness

 

[The Catboy]

Have those peeps constantly focusing on sources not yet realised that anything that doesn't follow a certain narrative gets banned from (or would never be expressed in the first place on) the sites you would consider a credible source? There is a lot of BS on the uncensored sites yes, but they're also the only place left for alternative views to exist freely.

It's a lot more effective to confront the actual arguments if the goal is to end up with better information. Of course, that's unlikely to happen if everyone is entrenched and the only goal is to win.

Requesting trustworthy sources and discarding junk is literally how you prevent misinformation from spreading. If a “source” is making claims without explaining how they got to that conclusion, without citing the research conducted or the sources they are quoting. Then it’s best to assume they either made everything up or they are deliberately hiding information for a narrative. If a source is making completely different claims from everyone else and aren’t citing where that claim came from, then it’s probably junk. The process of eliminating junk and misinformation is extremely important. Equally, the alternative views on vaccines is based on garbage. The anti-vax movement is not based on science and have only made false claims, spread misinformation, and spreadable diseases. Allowing their comments to go unchecked only encourages the spread of misinformation.

 

[tabzer]

Requesting trustworthy sources and discarding junk is literally how you prevent misinformation from spreading. If a “source” is making claims without explaining how they got to that conclusion, without citing the research conducted or the sources they are quoting. Then it’s best to assume they either made everything up or they are deliberately hiding information for a narrative. If a source is making completely different claims from everyone else and aren’t citing where that claim came from, then it’s probably junk. The process of eliminating junk and misinformation is extremely important. Equally, the alternative views on vaccines is based on garbage. The anti-vax movement is not based on science and have only made false claims, spread misinformation, and spreadable diseases. Allowing their comments to go unchecked only encourages the spread of misinformation.

So how do you make the claim that the vaccines are safe and effective when nobody has finished taking their 8th booster?

 

[The Catboy]

So how do you make the claim that the vaccines are safe and effective when nobody has finished taking their 8th booster?

Is this supposed to be some kind of "gotcha" or just an admittance that you are afraid of medicine?

 

[kekkius]

Italian, still no magic fluid in my veins, i know only 4 people that didn't get the vaccine, everyone around me continue to get covid, me UngaBunga think "i can get Green pass if i got infected." start to share water bottle, kiss and everything i can with infected people....talk with the 4 friend unsurprisely they are doing the same....moral of the story....we didn't get covid and aborted the mission after 1 month, people around us keep getting covid, we still have no magic fluid and we still have no covid....immagine my face when the government is going to make it mandatory *insert Disappointed meme*.....it feel like AOT zeke make titans, i'm still human, around me only Ymir subject, i fear for the titan control *meme AOT intro start playng*(Conspiracy theory mode off)

 

[The Catboy]

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Italian, still no magic fluid in my veins, i know only 4 people that didn't get the vaccine, everyone around me continue to get covid, me UngaBunga think "i can get Green pass if i got infected." start to share water bottle, kiss and everything i can with infected people....talk with the 4 friend unsurprisely they are doing the same....moral of the story....we didn't get covid and aborted the mission after 1 month, people around us keep getting covid, we still have no magic fluid and we still have no covid....immagine my face when the government is going to make it mandatory *insert Disappointed meme*.....it feel like AOT zeke make titans, i'm still human, around me only Ymir subject, i fear for the titan control *meme AOT intro start playng*(Conspiracy theory mode off)

One of the biggest reasons why Covid is still spreading to the vaccinated is because the current vaccines aren’t as effective on recent variants. This is the purpose of getting boosters, to increase the effectiveness of the vaccines. There’s also the reason of people acting like the vaccines make them immune and doing shit like going to parties/gatherings and letting their guard time. As for the whole, “I’ve never gotten it,” have you been tested? Did you get tested whenever you felt sick or possibly off? There’s always a slight chance that you were asymptomatic. There’s just as much of a chance that you’ve never gotten it, but without regular testing, that’s something that needs be considered.

 

[tabzer]

Is this supposed to be some kind of "gotcha" or just an admittance that you are afraid of medicine?

To make a conclusion before the end of an experiment is unreasonable. The question was rhetorical to point out that you already said something stupid. I don't need to trick you.

There are also already anomolies which could or could not be caused by the vaccine. At very best vaccines could be safe and effective.

It may be possible, even considering the unresolved cases, that the vaccine is safer than Covid statistically.

I have a problem with how you lot use statistics though. Frankly, it's fucked up.

If I told you that you have greater than %50 of suicide and that you will unlikely live out your 30's how willing would you be to abide by those statistics and base all your decisions around them? Let's say these are definite facts and to deny them would be anti-science. Is that the type of narrative you want to listen to? Or maybe you already believe this and are doing your part to fulfill the statistics.

 

[Lacius]

To make a conclusion before the end of an experiment is unreasonable. The question was rhetorical to point out that you already said something stupid. I don't need to trick you.

There are also already anomolies which could or could not be caused by the vaccine. At very best vaccines could be safe and effective.

It may be possible, even considering the unresolved cases, that the vaccine is safer than Covid statistically.

I have a problem with how you lot use statistics though. Frankly, it's fucked up.

If I told you that you have greater than %50 of suicide and that you will unlikely live out your 30's how willing would you be to abide by those statistics and base all your decisions around them? Let's say these are definite facts and to deny them would be anti-science. Is that the type of narrative you want to listen to? Or maybe you already believe this and are doing your part to fulfill the statistics.

What's fucked up is your blind rejection of the science that shows the vaccines to be safe and effective.

 

[urherenow]

I do know that COVID-19 was in the US back in 2019 before the doctors here knew what it was as I know somebody who his doctors are pretty sure had COVID in Dec 2019 despite no one knowing about it in the US until 2020.

Ummm... what? It wasn't being called COVID19 yet, but Trump specifically brought it up during his SOTU address. The pre-written transcript of which Pelosi ripped up on national TV? Remember?

 

[tabzer]

What's fucked up is your blind rejection of the science that shows the vaccines to be safe and effective.

I’m not rejecting potentially anomalous data. I’ve also already dropped a reference regarding indefinite repeated use of the vaccine that contradicts both the claim of safety and effectiveness. “Safe and effective” is not a scientific statement. It’s a catchphrase.

 

[Lacius]

I’ve also already dropped a reference regarding indefinite repeated use of the vaccine that contradicts both the claim of safety and effectiveness.

There's no substantive evidence that the vaccines aren't safe or effective.

There is very strong evidence they are safe and effective.

“Safe and effective” is not a scientific statement. It’s a catchphrase.

Things can, in fact, be demonstrated to be safe and/or effective scientifically. These are quantifiable metrics that are in science's domain. Try again.

 

[urherenow]

I was tested yesterday for travel today (in a few hours). While waiting for my results (felt like less than 10 minutes), 3 people popped positive. I felt more at risk having to be in the same room with the positives... distancing be damned, than I have in the past 2 years. 1 of those positives was both vaxxed, and had zero symptoms. His test was also for pre-travel, and he didn't look too happy...

Been using standard every-day masks here in Japan, but for the next week or so (as soon as I send this edit), it's gonna be nothing but KN95s for me. Can't afford to pop positive for the return trip!