For those under the age of 25; what does 9/11 mean to you?

[zekro94]

I just want to be able to laugh at things again. To be able to make jokes about things again.

Comedy was the last refuge to get away from all of this partisan hatred and divisiveness, and now we can't even have that.

I grew up with Married With Children and Roseanne and Ren & Stimpy. My parents watched reruns of The Jeffersons and All In The Family. NONE of that shit would fly today, and that's a tragedy.

I am just sick of people's FEELINGS mattering so much. America has never been more filled with soft ass pussies who want everything that they feel to be validated by others, and if it isn't, it's time to sue, time to cancel, time to contain, time to attack.

It's OKAY to not agree. It's OKAY to have differing views and motivations. What is important is to find the common ground and a shared sense of morality. Build from that base, without attacking the individual.

Attack IDEAS, not people. Combat POLICY, not humans.

I would hate to think that everything about me could be summed up by my allegiance to whatever political party I supported. We're all much more complex than that, and it does disservice to every human being to just instantly shove someone into a box because you could slap a label onto them.

Which is to say nothing of the gall, audacity and conceit of automatically thinking that one person is better than another, based solely on which American political party they align with. It's also very myopic. The world is vast, and there are thousands of different ways of life, none of which relate to American politics.

I try to expand my worldview so I don't just view the world through the lens of "Labor/Democrat" or "Right/Conservative".

One of the hardest lessons I've learned in life was to see the world in shades of grey, and I am still learning.

We had Married with children, Fresh prince of Bel-air, Friends, Seinfield in europe and it really felt as those shows were from another era so distant. The worst is nowadays you can't joke anymore about things ("but muh feelings" crowd get annoying). I mean try and imagine if they made Boondocks today, that series would be canceled after the first episode (people would be calling it racist despite the fact the show is making fun of stereotypes and is a social commentary with a sprinkle of fiction and the creator is black so....) It's sad we got to this. As I recall reading people say everything went in a bad direction after 9/11 (we all know it was because of harambe but that's a discussion for another time)

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

This meltdown came out of nowhere

I can't remember how many times I have directly asked you simply not to speak to me.

I told you NO. I thought you lefties were all about respecting it when someone repeatedly says NO!

Just stop talking to me, man. We aren't friends. You only come here to run your mouth. Just stop.

I said NO. Take NO for an answer. Just ignore me.

 

[ut2k4master]

I can't remember how many times I have directly asked you simply not to speak to me.

I told you NO. I thought you lefties were all about respecting it when someone repeatedly says NO!

Just stop talking to me, man. We aren't friends. You only come here to run your mouth. Just stop.

I said NO. Take NO for an answer. Just ignore me.

this is a public forum. i thought you were all about "free speech" and stuff

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

this is a public forum. i thought you were all about "free speech" and stuff

EDIT to remain on topic

His comment had nothing to do with the thread or the topic. Neither did mine just now, so I edited it.

This is asking kids today how 9/11 impacts them. Not for people to come here to air out their butthurt against a political party. This got off track a long time ago.

 

[smf]

or use preferred pronouns,

I look forward to when you meet the father of your partner and they say "hey son, call me dad" & you say "fuck off, I'm not calling you by your preferred name".

We had Married with children, Fresh prince of Bel-air, Friends, Seinfield in europe and it really felt as those shows were from another era so distant. The worst is nowadays you can't joke anymore about things ("but muh feelings" crowd get annoying). I mean try and imagine if they made Boondocks today, that series would be canceled after the first episode (people would be calling it racist despite the fact the show is making fun of stereotypes and is a social commentary with a sprinkle of fiction and the creator is black so....) It's sad we got to this. As I recall reading people say everything went in a bad direction after 9/11 (we all know it was because of harambe but that's a discussion for another time)

I still find there is as much comedy around as there always was. It's just not as lazy as shows were in the old days.
But that is only partly down to changing times, in the 1960's you could do something like Monty Python and get millions of viewers. It was shit, but there wasn't much competition and if there was then it was shittier.

 

[Xzi]

I don't think you are right. While they may have been warned about it, I don't think anyone expected it to happen.

If info about the threat is reaching the president's desk, it's serious. There's a non-zero chance GWB didn't bother reading those specific intelligence briefs, but nobody in his staff would own up to that even if true.

Maybe you should be more specific about what you mean by "conservatives" then? Also, you kind of detracted from the subject of war profiteering there. In the modern American sense, I can understand where you're coming from, but you're also kind of generalizing when you say it's conservative people, even though political beliefs are largely on a spectrum, even among people who are "liberal" or "conservative. This is why I mostly categorize it as it being twisted people who are in power when it comes to profiting off of war. Once you start lumping the general populous in with them, or even the soldiers who they've tragically convinced to fight their wars for them, you start to lose sight of the actual problem, and you paint a target on the backs of people who may not even be in support of such actions and may even be outright oblivious to them.

I was lumping in "fear profiteering" as well, yes. If the general populace is incapable of basic pattern recognition, then the world is pretty well fucked. Boris Johnson profited from Brexit while the rest of the country suffered for it. Putin, Netanyahu, GWB, the Ayatollah, Saudi royals, etc never saw a form of imperialism they didn't like. Globally, conservatism is quickly becoming synonymous with fascism.

 

[smf]

My pronouns are Fuck/Off.

I still believe 9/11 was either planned, known or instigated by the United States.

I don't understand conspiracy theorists, Fuck think that something like that could be planned and instigated without anyone ever leaking it. Off aren't really thinking clearly.

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

I look forward to when you meet the father of your partner and they say "hey son, call me dad" & you say "fuck off, I'm not calling you by your preferred name".


I still find there is as much comedy around as there always was. It's just not as lazy as shows were in the old days.
But that is only partly down to changing times, in the 1960's you could do something like Monty Python and get millions of viewers. It was shit, but there wasn't much competition and if there was then it was shittier.

I'm pretty ugly. Not much chance of me ever getting married.

Monty Python has been under threat of cancellation for decades, for lots of reasons. Now it is actually taking root, though. John Cleese has been on record defending their sketches from the hard left who now want to retroactively cancel them, for pointing out how silly certain things that are prevalent in our culture and society in 2023 already WERE back in the 60's.

Dave Chappelle used to be world-renowned as one of the cleverest comedians who could tackle any topic in society, and make people laugh. Now HE is under threat of cancellation, but at least he weathered the storm.

Think about Eddie Murphy - Raw. Imagine ANYONE performing that act, today. No way. Absolutely no way. There would be a tearful apology video posted to X (formerly known as Twitter) within 24 hours.

We are so soft. It's so, so sad.

 

[smf]

There's a non-zero chance GWB didn't bother reading those specific intelligence briefs, but nobody in his staff would own up to that even if true.

There are enough people who were blamed, that any evidence the information made it anywhere near the top of the chain would be released.

https://oig.justice.gov/sites/default/files/archive/special/0506/chapter5.htm

V. OIG conclusions

In sum, we found individual and systemic failings in the FBI’s handling of information regarding the Hazmi and Mihdhar matter. The FBI had at least five opportunities to learn about their presence in the United States and to seek to find them before September 11, 2001. Much of the cause for these lost opportunities involved systemic problems. We found information sharing problems between the CIA and the FBI and systemic problems within the FBI related to counterterrorism investigations. The systemic problems included inadequate oversight and guidance provided to FBI detailees at the CIA, the FBI employees’ lack of understanding of CIA procedures, the inconsistent documentation of intelligence information received informally by the FBI, the lack of priority given to counterterrorism investigations by the FBI before September 11, and the effect of the wall on FBI criminal investigations.

Our review also found that the CIA did not provide information to the FBI about Hazmi and Mihdhar when it should have and we believe the CIA shares significant responsibility for the breakdown in the Hazmi and Mihdhar case. However, the FBI also failed to fully exploit the information that was made available to them. In addition, the FBI did not assign sufficient priority to the investigation when it learned in August 2001 that Hazmi and Mihdhar were in the in the United States. While we do not know what would have happened had the FBI learned sooner or pursued its investigation more aggressively, the FBI lost several important opportunities to find Hazmi and Mihdhar before the September 11 attacks.

Post automatically merged: Sep 12, 2023

Dave Chappelle used to be world-renowned as one of the cleverest comedians who could tackle any topic in society, and make people laugh. Now HE is under threat of cancellation, but at least he weathered the storm.

Think about Eddie Murphy - Raw. Imagine ANYONE performing that act, today. No way. Absolutely no way. There would be a tearful apology video posted to X (formerly known as Twitter) within 24 hours.

We are so soft. It's so, so sad.

Ricky Gervais hasn't been cancelled.

Dave Chappelle used to be world renowned, but then people became better.

My favorite comedian at the moment is Steward Lee. He can tackle any topic in society and make people laugh.

 

[GolfDude]

cancel culture is real, and anyone who uses twitter to get a person to get fired from their job b/c they dont believe what they do deserve to lose their right to using any social media period.. people who deny it should not have ht right to use any social media platforms.. they wanna remove a persons right to work, then we have the right to remove your right to use social media.. you cant get it both ways.. you wanna cancel, prepare to be cancelled yourself..

 

[Xzi]

There are enough people who were blamed, that any evidence the information made it anywhere near the top of the chain would be released.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bin_Ladin_Determined_To_Strike_in_US

Naturally, the Bush administration was eager to lay all the blame at the feet of the CIA, but I don't buy it. You get a briefing like that and you order preventative action to be taken, full stop.

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

Ricky Gervais hasn't been cancelled.

Dave Chappelle used to be world renowned, but then people became better.

My favorite comedian at the moment is Steward Lee. He can tackle any topic in society and make people laugh.

There would be no Key and Peele without Dave Chappelle. That, alone, makes his existence worthy.

There would be no Pablo Franscisco without Dave Chappelle.

And there would be no Dave Chappelle without Eddie Murphy.

And there would be no Eddie Murphy without Richard Pryor.

Comedy is the one thing that should never be cancelled or censored, in any way. I don't give a flying flipping flapping fuck if ANYONE gets offended over a joke from a comedian. Life is horrible, and laughing makes it better.

If you are easily offended, go watch Full House. I bet you'd still find something to get fannyharmed over that show, too, though.

Comedy is where the brain goes to tickle itself. Nothing should be off-limits. Comedians are not mean-spirited. They wouldn't make any money if all they did was piss people off and were actually out there to hurt people (Michael Richards). They WANT you to laugh, and sometimes, maybe feel a bit uncomfortable, and sometimes, maybe THINK.

It's like Matt Stone and Trey Parker said. Either everything is okay to make fun of, or nothing is.

I am on the side of "make fun of everything". And I don't care if you don't agree, I am still going to find things in life to laugh at, irrespective of your sensitive feels.

Tell me that you have never laughed at a Catholic priest joke, or a Michael Jackson joke, before you say that you shouldn't joke about specific sensitive topics. I would count child exploitation as a serious, sensitive topic. And I still laugh at jokes about it, without shame. BECAUSE THEY ARE JOKES.

 

[smf]

I am on the side of "make fun of everything". And I don't care if you don't agree, I am still going to find things in life to laugh at, irrespective of your sensitive feels.

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

Okay. You might be right.

 

[Delerious]

No one uses more propaganda than the left.

I would actually disagree with you there. When it comes to the current day social landscape, I can see where you're coming from, but historically, you kind of have to take into account how much propaganda has been pushed in favor of things like war or McCarthyism. Hell, we've even been sold a lot of grandiose ideas about our economy and the "American Dream" by people who either control, or are in bed with the business sector. While not all of these people are going to be conservative, there are still some who are, especially when it comes to those who have subscribed to Reaganomics. Plus, election campaigns themselves can be considered a form of propaganda.

I was lumping in "fear profiteering" as well, yes. If the general populace is incapable of basic pattern recognition, then the world is pretty well fucked. Boris Johnson profited from Brexit while the rest of the country suffered for it. Putin, Netanyahu, GWB, the Ayatollah, Saudi royals, etc never saw a form of imperialism they didn't like. Globally, conservatism is quickly becoming synonymous with fascism.

Again, conservatism, like any any other political belief, exists on a spectrum. For these people, they are the absolute extreme. And if you're going to bring up crooked leaders, then you also need to take into account various leaders in other regimes that have also resorted to tyrannical practices in order to maintain power, and likewise end up profiting off of conflict. Otherwise, you are literally just cherry-picking. Again, it's insane people in power that create these problems.

In regards to your argument about the general populace, consider that a good percentage of us do recognize a large part of where the issue lies, and yet, what has even been done? Knowledge alone isn't enough to stave off the problem. Action in the form of a (strongly) united front is. So even among those of us who are aware of all the problems in the world, what are we really even doing about it? Face it, you, me and everybody else have basically been tamed. In that sense, are we not just as, if not, even more guilty than anyone else for the problem if we aren't acting against it? And in that case, I wouldn't be so quick to judge those that have, unfortunately subscribed to the propaganda, at least, not those who have yet to commit horrible acts because of it.

 

[Xzi]

cancel culture is real, and anyone who uses twitter to get a person to get fired from their job b/c they dont believe what they do deserve to lose their right to using any social media period.. people who deny it should not have ht right to use any social media platforms.. they wanna remove a persons right to work, then we have the right to remove your right to use social media.. you cant get it both ways.. you wanna cancel, prepare to be cancelled yourself..

Normal people don't have to fear societal repercussions for their actions. Maladjusted racist/sexist CHUDs will always be ostracized, because otherwise civilized society breaks down.

That said, Twitter is a poor example to use now that Elon allows unlimited use of racial slurs and death threats. Turning it into a safe space for scum has its own consequences (see: $22 billion in prospective value lost), but billionaires' fringe political views shouldn't be allowed to have that much influence on public discourse regardless.

 

[zekro94]

Comedy is the one thing that should never be cancelled or censored, in any way. I don't give a flying flipping flapping fuck if ANYONE gets offended over a joke from a comedian. Life is horrible, and laughing makes it better.

If you are easily offended, go watch Full House. I bet you'd still find something to get fannyharmed over that show, too, though.

Comedy is where the brain goes to tickle itself. Nothing should be off-limits. Comedians are not mean-spirited. They wouldn't make any money if all they did was piss people off and were actually out there to hurt people (Michael Richards). They WANT you to laugh, and sometimes, maybe feel a bit uncomfortable, and sometimes, maybe THINK.

It's like Matt Stone and Trey Parker said. Either everything is okay to make fun of, or nothing is.

I am on the side of "make fun of everything". And I don't care if you don't agree, I am still going to find things in life to laugh at, irrespective of your sensitive feels.

Tell me that you have never laughed at a Catholic priest joke, or a Michael Jackson joke, before you say that you shouldn't joke about specific sensitive topics. I would count child exploitation as a serious, sensitive topic. And I still laugh at jokes about it, without shame. BECAUSE THEY ARE JOKES.

Yep, agree, comedy should be a free for all. I consider the holocaust a great tragedy but still laugh about memes of hitler or other insensitive jokes. If someone gets offended then they should just turn the other way and let people enjoy things. 9/11 was a tragedy but I still laugh at jokes made about it. Sometimes people should just live and let live

 

[WalterSlovotsky]

Normal people don't have to fear societal repercussions for their actions. Maladjusted racist/sexist CHUDs will always be ostracized, because otherwise civilized society breaks down.

That said, Twitter is a poor example to use now that Elon allows unlimited use of racial slurs and death threats. Turning it into a safe space for scum has its own consequences (see: $22 billion in prospective value lost), but billionaires' fringe political views shouldn't be allowed to have that much influence on public discourse regardless.

What does any of this have to do with kids' reactions and perceptions of 9/11?

 

[Xzi]

And if you're going to bring up crooked leaders, then you also need to take into account various leaders in other regimes that have also resorted to tyrannical practices in order to maintain power, and likewise end up profiting off of conflict. Otherwise, you are literally just cherry-picking.

It's not cherry-picking if there aren't any examples of modern leftist leaders who are guilty of the same things. On a select few topics, the "both sides" argument is valid, but this isn't one of them.

In regards to your argument about the general populace, consider that a good percentage of us do recognize a large part of where the issue lies, and yet, what has even been done?

Depends on what you consider a "good percentage," because I feel like many Americans do have the memory of a goldfish. Might be the increasing levels of CO2 in the atmosphere.

What does any of this have to do with kids' reactions and perceptions of 9/11?

You'd have to ask GolfDude, I was simply replying to his tangent.

 

[Hanafuda]

We had Married with children, Fresh prince of Bel-air, Friends, Seinfield in europe and it really felt as those shows were from another era so distant. The worst is nowadays you can't joke anymore about things ("but muh feelings" crowd get annoying). I mean try and imagine if they made Boondocks today, that series would be canceled after the first episode (people would be calling it racist despite the fact the show is making fun of stereotypes and is a social commentary with a sprinkle of fiction and the creator is black so....) It's sad we got to this. As I recall reading people say everything went in a bad direction after 9/11 (we all know it was because of harambe but that's a discussion for another time)

You ought to see some of The Jeffersons, All in the Family, and Sanford & Son. You got some jokes about white people, you got some jokes about black people. Everyone watched. Everyone laughed. (There were only three channels anyway.)