Gaming My Rant to Apple Haters

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BakuFunn

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Imperial, you're the nicer more forgiving me. I think my rampant cussing and insults along with my valiant points effectively negate everything, and then some more to bring my score down past zero.

Here's a cookie for being a true diplomat.
 

themuddaload

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i read both your posts. yes im bored.

the biggest problem i have with macs is how they act like a windows computer is inferior just for being windows...

im a mac, and im a pc, hurr durr...

im currently running vista 64 bit (ultimate) and i have never had a virus.

my highschool had a mac lab (for computer graphics and web design [someone care to tell me how macs are superior in these fields, as they are claimed to be by fanboys and the like?])

while they never got a BSOD, we had one do the mac version, a Grey Screen Of Death every other week or so. that, and the server got a trojan that made it mirror some kind of gay porn.

i cant recall ever seeing any of my highschool's windows labs have a computer with a BSOD

yes, apple now has steam. im happy for them.
however, if you are playing tf2, you may have a problem playing as Heavy without some reconfig on the keys, as the apple mouse may be able to right click, but they are incapable of clicking both at once.

i object to how apple puts on airs about being superior, with no real fact behind it.
the "apple tax" just helps me in my leanings towards computers running windows.

if the price was the same, and i could upgrade the hardware, and there was more games available, i would just as likely buy a mac as anything else.
 

Mangofett

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BakuFunn said:
Linkiboy said:
Don't bash OSX on atom before you've tried it. I have an atom hackintosh and it works fine in all day to day situations.
I didn't bash shit. You should probably read the posts.
I'm saying that Atom can not compare to a Core 2 Duo in terms of power.
I have a Hackintosh HP Mini (the one without ion) with Snow Leopard and Windows 7 on it. It works fine in day to day situations. It can not match the MacBook Air. The guy said his fucking 300$ netbook outfuckingperforms a MacBook Air. His modest (there, you happy?) Atom processor will not compare to a fucking Core 2 ducking Duo.

Why am I even restating this? Reread my post.
Whoa, calm down. I wasn't talking to you. I was talking to the guy who called it pathetic. It's not.
 

nutella

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Every post here has some truth in it. Personally, Apple products will always be second place at best. Sure, I like the iPhone, but there are other products I like better. I have a hackintosh ion netbook as well, which has a triple boot of Windows 7, Linux Mint 9 and Snow Leopard and in my experience, all three OS's are incredible, but I would never say Snow Leopard is the best by any standard.

The problem I have with Apple is their user base. I hate to generalize, people who buy Apple products mostly don't know any better. They're buying Apple products because they're Apple products, not because they think its any better. Honestly, like someone said earlier, a shit tonne of Mac users are stupid and don't care about all the facts you mentioned. I have a friend who bought a 15 inch Mac Book Pro for $2500, and he uses it for e-mail. He bought it because it was Apple dude, not because he thought it was quality. That just pisses me off. Essentially, there are more Apple fanboys than haters. Much, much more.

As to why I hate Apple, to me, its not only that they're products are overpriced, but that Apple pretty much controls the user experience. I feel restricted using any Apple product, and really, I shouldn't. But again, that's opinion. Now here's the other problem. Why is it that everyone either has to love or hate Apple? Why is it that when I say anything bad about Apple, people start bashing me? I guess that goes for all fanboyism, and I sure as hell hate it.

EDIT: Should have read your whole post, because you did address both those issues. Nonetheless, my main point still stands (and pretty much everyone else's too). I hate Apple, that's my opinion. People should just let people be.
 
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You guys are getting way too worked up. As has already been mentioned in this thread, macs are advertised as more of a clean-cut OCD fashion-statement; they're very uniform.

Is it also possible that the comparison between an atom-cpu and a C2Duo computer was simply a reference to day-to-day performance needs? Correct me if you like (though, I probably won't re-visit this thread), but both computers have the strength to run the OS at a fluent average-user level, yes? Whether or not the C2Duo is more powerful (which it is) is a moot-point.

Furthermore, because apple over-prices everything by astounding proportions, one of the reasons I'll never go apple is simply because of the bang/buck performance ratio offered by windows computers.

The base config of both macbooks airs are super-saturated at $1500/1800 USD. From a purely casual, average users perspective, saving 500-600% cash with a $300 atom netbook that will perform all the basic tasks fluently seems like a pretty good deal to me, regardless of whether or not the core two duo has more functionality. All in all, netbooks are primarily for internet, e-mail and word-processing; they're not build for much else, and thinking of them as such defeats their design.
 

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I read, and skimmed the article. Apple overcharges, it's as simple as that. Why pay $700 more for a computer that has the basic specs as a clone, with minor perks. I don't like their advertising schemes either. It's like a prediction of Sony at E3 (the insulting I mean), their advertisements only bash Windows based computers. They manipulate the info they have, and in the process they manipulate people too. Windows ad I have yet to see them bashing apple. Also actually the Xerox P.C. was never for sale, the one that came out was an Apple fail: The Lisa. Then the Macintosh was born. They really started the P.C. standard, but when clones came out things became cheaper, and people bought these. Products that can't compete with similar features as another product is generally due to price range. The reason the iPhone/Touch is more popular is because they basically defined this area and held on to it. The same cannot be said for the P.C. standard. This is why Mac has not been able to compete.

EDIT: Please be careful how you throw around "for people like you". This sounds offensive in just looking at the pure text. Which makes me think that anyone who tries to put a different view, is just looked down upon. I suggest you revise the way you type you words.

EDIT2: Also, I read your damned article, and nothing you say impresses me. While you say you are a very knowledgeable widows user, why do you not provide evidence to back up this statement. Like a feature compare and contrast list.
 

Originality

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I read both articles and I think I'll post this in both threads too.

Simple fact about Macs; my 2nd Generation iPod will crash any Mac (on any OS) within 5 minutes of plugging it in via USB. Snow Leopard did nothing to fix this, and it's nothing to do with viruses either - just bad hardware/software.

Both PC and Macs are very good platforms though. I see the entire debate as nothing more than an excuse for people to have a flamewar. The same with the 360vPS3 debate. Some people just enjoy trolling and flaming, whether they believe their words or not. Even the argument of the "Apple Tax" doesn't really matter, since people who buy Macs will buy them no matter what the price. iPods have always been overpriced, yet since its release, I've never had a bus trip without one person waving their iPod about. Not one.

The only gripe I have with Apple is iTunes. I spent 3 years of my life having to struggle with that damned program trying to put music on my Motorola V3i m. I spent 2 further years struggling with that damned program trying to put music on my Gen2 iPod. By now there are ways to put music on without needing iTunes, but in those days I had no choice and I hated every minute of it. People may argue with me on this point, and they can feel free too, but it's easily the worst music management application I've ever used.
 

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Originality said:
I read both articles and I think I'll post this in both threads too.

Simple fact about Macs; my 2nd Generation iPod will crash any Mac (on any OS) within 5 minutes of plugging it in via USB. Snow Leopard did nothing to fix this, and it's nothing to do with viruses either - just bad hardware/software.

Both PC and Macs are very good platforms though. I see the entire debate as nothing more than an excuse for people to have a flamewar. The same with the 360vPS3 debate. Some people just enjoy trolling and flaming, whether they believe their words or not. Even the argument of the "Apple Tax" doesn't really matter, since people who buy Macs will buy them no matter what the price. iPods have always been overpriced, yet since its release, I've never had a bus trip without one person waving their iPod about. Not one.

The only gripe I have with Apple is iTunes. I spent 3 years of my life having to struggle with that damned program trying to put music on my Motorola V3i m. I spent 2 further years struggling with that damned program trying to put music on my Gen2 iPod. By now there are ways to put music on without needing iTunes, but in those days I had no choice and I hated every minute of it. People may argue with me on this point, and they can feel free too, but it's easily the worst music management application I've ever used.


first, you should of returned your ipod as soon as you experienced problems. apple is not gonna come to your house to check on how your are doing. second, it's not apples job to provide music management for your motorola, it's motorola's job but i guess you expect apple to pick up other manufacturer's slack and that's why apple controls their own hardware and software.
 

Talaria

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I have no quarrel with people who fight for Macs, Windows, Linux and any other OS, everyone has their own preference. I also have no problems with people getting Macs for intelligent reasons. But unfortunately I've come across too many Mac owners who own it for a fashion statement. Lets be honest here its become more of a fad. Apple has become this concept in peoples mind for the lack of a better word "Cool". Many people buy one, not because of specs or they prefer the OS but rather simply because it says a statement. For example walking through my university's library here's a running commentary "Ooooh there is a Electrical Engineering student studying using a laptop with Linux or a derivative installed. And over here are some female Arts Students, several Macs and ahh one Laptop running XP oh wait its a guy using it." etc. You catch my drift.

Exeunt
 

Psyfira

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It's nice to hear a well rounded discussion on the subject
smile.gif


I think this comes back to "are the extra features driving the price up just as important as the core specs"?

I'm in the camp that has never brough an Apple product, not because of hate but because their products have never been the best option for me. To me, they do look overpriced. The one time I've had to make a serious choice between an Apple product or another was purchasing an MP3 player in 2006. At the time the iPod offered far lower specs than Creative for the same money; both players used microdrives with the same durability issue of spinning harddrives in a portable device. It was just plain marketing. As a user, disk space was pretty high on my priority list so the Apple product lost.

Not to assume that all of Apple's products are the same, but everyone uses past experience when they shape an opinion of something
wink.gif


I'd never heard the argument for why Macbooks are so expensive before, so it's nice to hear that side of the story for a change. Features like a sudden drop sensor and a rugged exterior, I'm going to be honest I don't intend on being so careless with it. They're a safety net when they're there, but how many people actually need them? It's good to hear a justification for the difference, but as others have said, it's the swarms of people who buy Macs just because they're cool and don't consider whether the markup is actually worth it for them as end users and the way how they will use the device who wind people up. Even after reading this, most users don't need those "extra features" you've listed, and I still wouldn't consider the Macbook as an option if I was buying a laptop because they are just too expensive for what you get. That's just my opinon.
 

BakuFunn

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I2aven's_Sage said:
You guys are getting way too worked up. As has already been mentioned in this thread, macs are advertised as more of a clean-cut OCD fashion-statement; they're very uniform.

Is it also possible that the comparison between an atom-cpu and a C2Duo computer was simply a reference to day-to-day performance needs? Correct me if you like (though, I probably won't re-visit this thread), but both computers have the strength to run the OS at a fluent average-user level, yes? Whether or not the C2Duo is more powerful (which it is) is a moot-point.

Furthermore, because apple over-prices everything by astounding proportions, one of the reasons I'll never go apple is simply because of the bang/buck performance ratio offered by windows computers.

The base config of both macbooks airs are super-saturated at $1500/1800 USD. From a purely casual, average users perspective, saving 500-600% cash with a $300 atom netbook that will perform all the basic tasks fluently seems like a pretty good deal to me, regardless of whether or not the core two duo has more functionality. All in all, netbooks are primarily for internet, e-mail and word-processing; they're not build for much else, and thinking of them as such defeats their design.

Here is what he said

QUOTE(murkurie @ Jul 18 2010, 04:02 PM) The “Apple Tax”, my $300 Netbook is as fast as a macbook air, yet is by far cheaper.

I'm sorry, but if you think an Atom is as fast as a Core 2 Duo, I'd better swap the C2Ds in my PC and get Atom, pocketing some cash as well. My HP Mini can handle Snow Leopard very nicely, should I say it's as fast as my iMac?
Most processors can handle the OS, so why not just use the cheapest one? Why get an i7 at all? A MacBook Air is incredibly niche and is NOT for the average netsurfer. And even then, it's a full size underpowered notebook years old. Personally, I think it sucks. But really... Atom? I'm sure you guys have had Core 2 Duos. They're fast. Atom isn't. (in fucking comparision)
 

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Apple products are overpriced pieces of crap. People will continue to buy iPhone 4s, even though it has a well known design flaw, just because they need to keep up with the Jones'. Not to mention the arrogance of the head of the company. Rather than saying hey we're sorry we fucked up. He tells his loyal customers; you're holding it wrong. Then he trys to lie and say a software fix will solve a problem clearly caused by the hardware design? And people will continue to hang on Steve's every word and buy his latest round of crap that will make your last piece of crap obsolete.
 

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I will never understand the mentality of Apple fans. I've tried on numerous occasions and have never had a complete and well-rounded grasp on exactly what goes through their head when they write posts on the Internet. Much in the same way I don't understand the mentality of Sony fans; I really don't see how someone can love a company that can't back itself up with <i>just</i> quality products - they have to resort to mudslinging in their commercials and press conferences to make themselves seem desirable.

I don't like Apple and Apple products for many reasons. Before I really start into this post, I'm going to let you know now that I've used windows for most of my life, but I did switch to mostly using OS X back around 2007 and maintained that through to the end of 2008, which is when I'd had enough of the OS and switched back to Windows. I've had good, long chances to use many of the products I'm going to talk about, and I always go into them actually <i>looking for an alternative to what I'm using</i>.

First off, I hate Apple's marketing schemes. Using insults and mis-direction in your commercials makes Apple look really weak and pathetic as a company right away. Much like those jerks you used to meet in school who'd pick on you for something irrelevant or pointless; Apple's marketing is really juvenile and dirty. A company that can't hold it's own based off of reputable and time-proven products without resorting to silly smear campaigns is one that is obviously trying to misdirect or brainwash (I hate using that word, but in this situation I cannot think of an alternative) their customers into believing less than the truth and/or the facts.

The Mac commercials are very blatant in this, and if you cannot see it then you've been the victim of another successful Apple commercial. Ads in which they claim such blatant lies like, "Mac's don't crash," or "Mac's don't get viruses," are examples of false information being presented in a manner that attempts to damage the reputation of it's competitor. In my time with my Mac, OS X crashed more times in a month than my Windows machine had in a year, and I leave them running practically 24/7. Even if statistically my 1 case was the only case of a mac crashing, that already makes Apple a liar for telling me my product wont crash. A correct statement after the fact would then be, "Most Mac's wont crash."

Same thing goes for this '<i>Mac's don't get viruses</i>' malarkey. If Mac's were shielded 100% from viruses, <b>anti-virus software for the Mac, and websites like <a href="http://www.securemac.com/" target="_blank">this one</a> wouldn't exist.</b> There are always risks with anything you buy that malicious code could damage it. It's unfortunately a sad fact of technology. Besides, if you're careful - regardless of operating system - you wont need to worry about viruses any way. I've been virus-free for years on my Windows machine, without UAC turned on, using only Microsoft Security Essentials and nothing more. No bloated Norton or McAfee installs bogging down my system and sucking my bank account dry, but also no viruses impairing my ability to use my computer.

Apple simply use either direct lies, misdirection or omission of information to attempt to trick the viewer into believing that Apple's product is clearly the better one. I'm not going to lie here - this is a brilliant marketing scheme. It's still nefarious and pathetic, but no one can say it doesn't work. Whoever does Apple's advertising should be proud. That person has managed to train a generation to think and act the exact same way while making them believe they're being original and unique. That person has also successfully disassociated computers running OS X from computers running Windows by using the terms <i>Mac</i> and <i>PC</i> while at the same time giving PC a negative connotation. It's a perfect base for a marketing platform.

Most people use the terms in every day life <i>just</i> as Apple intended without even thinking about it. Apple has made people believe that Macs either aren't <i>just</i> a PC, or that Macs aren't PCs at all, ignoring what <i>PC</i> actually stands for. This is the foundation of Apple fan's platform of idiocy. Almost every person in an argument for Apple VS. Microsoft will use the terms Mac VS. PC, and arguing about Macs VS. PCs is illogical and fallacious. PC stands for Personal Computer, which by definition means, "a computer that is used by one person at a time in a business, a school, or at home."

Macintosh machines are just that: a PC. Up until recently, the only difference at the hardware level was that Macs used IBM processors instead of Intel. In these times, the innards of a Mac can be the same as any other machine. These days you can literally build your own tower for use with OS X, and it runs just the same as a Mac machine but at a significantly reduced cost. They're called Hackintosh machines. People need to understand that the term Mac refers to the hardware that OS X is running on, NOT the OS itself. This is the same as if I were to substitute Dell instead of PC. Then I could debate Dell VS. Mac, or Dell VS. Asus, or even Mac VS. Alienware. These are all PCs, but I am substituting the brand so you understand which I am talking about.

This also ties in again to Apple's motive to make you think Mac products will make you 'hip' and 'unique', but what most Mac users don't seem to notice is that <b>all of their god damn products <i>look the same</i></b>. The whole idea of using Justin Long to associate individuality and personality with Macs while at the same time using John Hodgman to make Windows machines look like lame, cookie-cutter computers is actually a factual role-reversal.

Wanna <i>see</i> what I mean? <a href="http://shopperism.com/images/apple_imac_new_aluminum.jpg" target="_blank">Here</a> is a picture of a line of iMacs. You can't get iMacs in any other color other than 'aluminum', as far as I know. You can't get them in any other design, either. Now <a href="http://powerdeals.in/powerdeals/images/products/dell_desktop.230135040_std.jpg" target="_blank">here</a> <a href="http://www.techpin.com/wp-content/uploads/2008/10/alienware-aurora-one-of-the-best-desktop-computers-for-gaming-2.jpg" target="_blank">are</a> <a href="http://www.maximumpc.com/files/u22694/Rosewill_beauty.jpg" target="_blank">some</a> <a href="http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/410CJ7-vctL.jpg" target="_blank">Windows machine</a> <a href="http://www.xbitlabs.com/images/editorial/cebit2008-2/foxconn3_sm.jpg" target="_blank">cases</a>. Notice how original and unique the cases for Windows machines are? Notice how unoriginal and cookie-cutter the iMacs are? Yeah. You're smart, I'll let you draw the conclusions.

I really don't like the iMac. I mean, it looks sleek, yes. However, everything is really dead-set and impractical. I like Windows machines because they're <i>customizable</i>. With a Mac, you <i>can't</i> put an all-in-one card reader in the front bay. I can't go out and buy a stick of Ram and put it in my self with ease. If I drop my monitor, I have to send the whole damn computer in for repairs while I'm left with nothing. On a windows machine if I wanted to add in Ram I'd put it in myself instead of sending the whole computer to Apple to do it. If I dropped the monitor, I'd send <i>just the monitor</i> in for a repair and use a temporary one with my undamaged computer that didn't get sent out. If I wanted to put something in my case, I wouldn't void my warranty doing so.

This lack of control over your product after you've paid <i>a lot</i> of money for it is ridiculous. This is Steve Jobs' incessant need to control every facet of your life showing it's ugly face. When I pay money for a product, I'm not leasing it from a company. The product is now <i>my property</i>, and I should be able to do with it what I want (within a legal setting) without consequence. Making up worthless excuses for having such a closed platform and strict control over end-user products <i>after</i> they've left the shelves such as '<i>compromised user experience</i>' or '<i>piracy concerns</i>' is moronic.

Apple likes to group all their users in to one category: <i>idiots</i>. And as such, they place limitations on their products and say that it's 'in the best interest for their users.' Apple products <i>are actually designed for morons to use them.</i> It's great for those who're kinda new or not into the whole tech scene, but for people like me this is a negative point. I want to be able to use my device in whichever way I choose. This is why I bought it. Limiting us and then telling us it's because we're not smart enough is adding insult to injury.

The iPhone is a great example of this. <i>Without Jailbreaking</i>, the iPhone is a very limited and irritating platform. We're not allowed to install apps that aren't approved by Apple's crack team of censors. Useful would-be apps like Google Voice have been unfairly declined from the app store because they're in direct competition with existing official Apple apps. It's a really unfair environment and the only apps that get accepted are really pointless and stupid, like the one where you throw crumpled paper into a trash can. <i>What the hell?</i> Useful apps get declined but pointless BS like this or 'the fart button' get in?

Also the lack of Flash support is stupid. Apple has a tendency to pick battles it cannot win. In the last few years Apple has fought both Google and Adobe, the two companies that make Apple products actually useful. Why? What's the point? If Adobe stops supporting the Mac, then Macs lose their core consumers who use Macs for Photoshop and the like. Blaming Adobe for your lack of support with Flash, then disallowing apps made in Flash in the app store is like a big middle finger and <i>makes no sense from a business standpoint</i>. Flash has already been proven to work effectively on smart phones, look at the Droid X.

Apple is just being stubborn in relinquishing it's monopoly on the iPhone because once Flash support is added, people can just make apps in flash and post them online for free. The App Store becomes outdated and Apple loses money. Apple isn't on some 'noble crusade' to get Adobe to shape up Flash or move everyone to HTML5, they're just afraid of losing money, like any heartless and cold company.

I don't like Apple, and I don't like Apple fanboys. As stated in another post, they're the most immature, arrogant and irritating people you can meet. It's like they have a logic forcefield that blocks clear thinking and reason. My sister's boyfriend is a fanboy for Apple. He works at an Apple call center, and all he owns are Apple products. Whenever I ask him, "Why are Apple products better?" He can never come up with a clear reason without resorting to the things Mac fanboys usually spout off that are based on false information (viruses, crashing, etc.).

In general, I find whenever they are mentioned, I usually end up irritated after the conversation ends. This doesn't mean I refuse to use or acknowledge the existence of Apple products. In fact, <b>despite lack of flash support</b>, I'm going to get an iPhone 4 once the antenna issue is fixed at the hardware level and not with a damn free case. I'm going to jailbreak it to relinquish it from Apple's grip, but I'm still going to buy one. I think I would benefit from a smart phone, and the iPhone 4 has more of what I want. It's a toss up between the iPhone 4 and Droid X, whichever is cheaper when I go to buy a phone.

These are my thoughts and mine alone. Some of these are based on opinion, but a lot are actually just raw facts. I agree that preference comes down to opinion, and I don't hate Macs. I think Macs are more useful for certain people and those people shouldn't deviate from Macs. I just don't like Apple, Apple products or Apple fanboys, <i>personally</i>.

EDIT: Wow, this is a long post! I didn't realize I'd typed so much. It's probably gonna be TL;DR for a lot of you, but if you want a solid reasoning for not liking Apple, then give it a read.
 

juggernaut911

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This post has been removed by a moderator.

Reason: Juggernaut is the coolest guy i know.

This is going to explode into a blind flame war.

I love it.

Also, threads like this provoke fights.

I love it.
 

Frederica Bernkastel

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I see exactly where you're coming from, but I question the point of posting a long piece of tl;dr text in a section intended for help with computing related issues.
 

davidsl_128

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It's funny that you say that the Mac OS is one of the nice features of Macs... I actually like everything about them (cool, light, easy to use and safe) except that OS. I mean, it can probably hacked to be better, but the time I had a Mac I had to enter Windows mode to run almost every program I use.

If I had a MacBook Pro with Windows 7 I'd be happy. But learning how to that would be a pain in the ass
frown.gif
 

Kentoss

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Antoligy said:
I see exactly where you're coming from, but I question the point of posting a long piece of tl;dr text in a section intended for help with computing related issues.

*shrug* I can always copy and paste it to a more relevant location on demand, I suppose. This was more to get my thoughts out in writing for personal reasons, as well as answer OP's question as to why people like my don't like Apple.

That is, if this post was directed at me.
 
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