Previous Chinese spy balloons discovered after the fact

[TraderPatTX]

I don't get the controversy here. Google maps the entire earth and nobody cares. China does the same (okay... I don't know why it can't just be a weather balloon like they say) and the us does nothing. Then more nothing. And now shoots one down.

... And now threatens China not to send more weather balloons over their air space, because 'or else'.

Because China is a communist country, which means the CCP owns everything. There is no such thing as "civilian" in China. The CCP saying this is used for civilian purposes is to show who are the rubes who will believe anything they read without question.

Post automatically merged: Feb 9, 2023

So we spend $900 billion a year for the most advanced military in the world and it got circumvented by 19th century tech.

And people actually believe this without question? LOL

 

[djpannda]

Unless you've been gettting intelligence briefings from ex trump era intelligence staff, that's a mighty bit of speculation going on right there. The facts are your CURRENT president is an idiot and knew about this balloon for a while, and let it cross your entire country before it was shot down due to being shamed.

I like how the Bablylon Bee summed it up:



https://babylonbee.com/news/biden-s...py-balloon-as-soon-as-hes-done-letting-it-spy

This just is another pretty embarrassing thing in a long list to come out of US in the last 2 years. Your southern border leaks more than an umbrella made from a colander, and you've got spy balloons sending data back to the Chinese that didn't need to spent billions/trillions on a space program.

Thanks Joe B, the world is now a safer place since you took office. The Taliban are Armed & have night vision capability and a country, Russia has invaded it's neighbour and your tax payer is paying all the bills while your own Army has run out of bullets, and the Chinese have aerial data for your entire countries defences. Good job.

Cool story.

 

[Hanafuda]

Sounds like our intelligence agencies and/or the military didn't even bother keeping Trump in the loop regarding these balloons, then. Probably for the best.

That could be the case, in which case it was a dereliction of duty by the DoD persons in charge at the time. But I'm pretty sure the news on this from the Pentagon's statement was that they didn't know about the previous 3 balloons until after Trump was out. But they have not disclosed (also probably for the best) how they figured out well after the fact that previous balloons had flown over the CONUS.

Reality is we'll probably never know the truth of it.

 

[Deleted member 586536]

Unless you've been gettting intelligence briefings from ex trump era intelligence staff, that's a mighty bit of speculation going on right there. The facts are your CURRENT president is an idiot and knew about this balloon for a while, and let it cross your entire country before it was shot down due to being shamed.

And Trump let 3 pass, without any of them getting shot down.

 

[Xzi]

That could be the case, in which case it was a dereliction of duty by the DoD persons in charge at the time.

For the last couple years of his presidency he had stopped receiving intelligence briefings because he wasn't reading them or paying attention anyway. Better that we had actual adults making the decisions when it came to national security, especially considering all his foreign conflicts of interest.

 

[CMDreamer]

Damn, this is just too much crap.

What would be next? Kamikaze moles?

U.S. Government is desperate to find a reason (even if not valid) to attack the world and sell weapons to them all.

Peace is not a business for some big companies.

 

[x65943]

Damn, this is just too much crap.

What would be next? Kamikaze moles?

U.S. Government is desperate to find a reason (even if not valid) to attack the world and sell weapons to them all.

Peace is not a business for some big companies.

*China sends spy balloons to monitor US nuclear launch sites with multi thousand pounds payloads*

"Damn US war mongers!!"

???

 

[TraderPatTX]

And Trump let 3 pass, without any of them getting shot down.

Says anonymous sources, which we all know always tell the truth.

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

For the last couple years of his presidency he had stopped receiving intelligence briefings because he wasn't reading them or paying attention anyway. Better that we had actual adults making the decisions when it came to national security, especially considering all his foreign conflicts of interest.

He received intelligence briefings from the military, which means it was more accurate and trustworthy than the CIA.

 

[Xzi]

He received intelligence briefings from the military, which means it was more accurate and trustworthy than the CIA.

He stopped receiving briefings altogether, and didn't take anything away from the ones he did receive earlier in his presidency. By all accounts from people in the room, it was like trying to brief a pre-schooler with ADHD, right down to the fact that he'd regularly shit his diapers in front of everybody. Republicans really need to start showing a little more self-respect with their choice of candidates for the presidency, assuming they expect anyone else to ever respect them as a party again. If not, then carry on picking coked-out D-list reality TV celebs.

 

[Taleweaver]

1) Isn't it also suspicious that this isn't the first time?

2) And if it was just a weather balloon gone astray like they claim - they would have let us know - hey this drifted into your airspace don't freak out

3) The fact it was a secret, and they kept it a secret shows their hand

4) As for why a balloon for imaging - it's possible being closer it could get a slightly better image - it's also possible they are doing drills to practice in a scenario in which their satellites were destroyed (highly likely scenario in a future war setting)

5) It's also possible they could be practicing potential military maneuvers as a balloon with that payload could carry explosives or biological weapons

6) Regardless what they are doing or why, it's clear they kept it a secret from us - when non malevolent party would let us know of their "mistake" and incursion into our airspace the first time

But no they let 5 such balloons over and then we discovered them ourselves

1) rather the opposite to me. Presuming it is a weather balloon (i know that's still up for debate) , they presumed it'd be okay. Those things do tend to travel internationally. There's also the question to which height airspace goes. Maybe the owners just presumed that if satellites were fair game, so were balloons. Further enforced by the lack of response

2) sorry... Did they claimed it went astray? I honestly didn't know

3) here as well: did China deny the presence of their balloon prior? Heck... Did Biden or Trump even bothered to inquire before this incident?

4) this reminds me of a Simpsons episode. "thorough spy satellite checkouts have revealed the (mcguffin) is not on the roof!". You're asking me to believe China wants to risk exposure to covert plans... Just to get a "slightly better image"? Or that they think weather balloons are somehow less likely to get blown out of the sky than satellites out of space?
Look... I'm not trying to defend China here, but this sounds more like paranoia or damage control.

5) yeah. Could be. Because of course there's no way to practice that flying over their own air space

6) on that i agree. On the presumption that China denied the existence in the first place (sorry, but given his track record i don't think Trump even bothered bringing it up with his counterparts when he was first informed, and that first impression probably impacted the latter handlings)

Post automatically merged: Feb 11, 2023

During World War Two, the Japanese used high altitude balloons to send incendiary bombs and anti-personnel bombs to mainland USA. Most of them failed but the operation did cause six fatalities.

Imagine what a two thousand pound payload could do.

So any unidentified object floating in on the jet stream is a potential danger, or at the least a huge security issue.

And having four "weather balloons" "accidentally" fly over another country's territory without telling anyone is blatant bullshit, China was flexing by dangling its (helium-filled) balls in America's face to see how intimately they could teabag the US before the US would notice and react, so now it's time for a response.

I can imagine it just fine. I can also imagine a whole lot more efficient ways to drop bombs. As with @x65943 ,i think this is just speculation.

And... Let's just say i disagree with you. I don't think China was teasing you to shoot that thing down. It's not victim blaming (they were on your territory), but to me it's just an overreaction. Shoot first, blame second, ask questions later. My bet is this story will be forgotten in a few months when it turns out that thing only had weather data as "payload".

(what's with that "payload" word, btw? It's that the latest media trend to scare the audience or something? )

 

[TraderPatTX]

He stopped receiving briefings altogether, and didn't take anything away from the ones he did receive earlier in his presidency. By all accounts from people in the room, it was like trying to brief a pre-schooler with ADHD,

And amazingly, that plays right into how you feel.

right down to the fact that he'd regularly shit his diapers in front of everybody.

Why are you talking about Biden all of a sudden?

Republicans really need to start showing a little more self-respect with their choice of candidates for the presidency, assuming they expect anyone else to ever respect them as a party again. If not, then carry on picking coked-out D-list reality TV celebs.

Prove Trump has ever done coke.

We had a great conversation a while back, but you have gotten so stupid and emotional since then, I'm doubting you are the same person. Hopefully, the real Xzi resets their password. It looks like their account got hijacked.

 

[Viri]

And Trump let 3 pass, without any of them getting shot down.

Why would you shoot them down? You'd just freak out the population over a spy balloon. It's better to just play dumb, have gov agencies study them, see what's on board, and feed them false info. Which is most likely what the US gov did.

 

[Xzi]

And amazingly, that plays right into how you feel.

The accounts from people who were in the room are what they are regardless of your feelings or mine. And they come mostly from other Republicans.

Hopefully, the real Xzi resets their password. It looks like their account got hijacked.

As if I've ever had anything positive to say about Trump, or any billionaire for that matter. You're the one fighting to preserve the status quo out of some idiotic sense of loyalty to agent orange, remember? As if he'd ever do anything to reciprocate other than shit down your throat and tell you it's chocolate cake.

 

[LainaGabranth]

Here's the real question: Why the fuck would China even bother? Like, cut the American exceptionalism nonsense for twenty seconds and ask yourselves why they would willingly send a balloon full of bombs to the country that remains one of their biggest supporters? "Muh trade war," "Muh imperialism" mewlings from the rightoids aside (not that either of these complaints even matter to them anyways), companies still rely on China a fucking shitton for labor and China still relies on us a shitton for exports. They're not going to just suddenly do some headassed shit like that.

This big show of brovado over a fucking balloon is the most embarrassing shit ever and I expected a political party that dedicates itself to "rational, unemotional thinking" to have put more than twenty seconds of thought into this that go beyond "GRGHRGHRGHRHGR BLOW UP THEM DAMN CHINESE BALLOONS THEY'RE SPYIN ON MY GUNS" or some nonsense.

Every single person who felt even remotely threatened by this balloon is a fucking idiot and instead of pretending to be civil I'm just gonna go mask off and say it. This is the EPITOME of a nothing burger.

 

[TraderPatTX]

The accounts from people who were in the room are what they are regardless of your feelings or mine. And they come mostly from other Republicans.

But I'm told all Rethuglicans are liars. Which is it?

As if I've ever had anything positive to say about Trump, or any billionaire for that matter. You're the one fighting to preserve the status quo out of some idiotic sense of loyalty to agent orange, remember? As if he'd ever do anything to reciprocate other than shit down your throat and tell you it's chocolate cake.

Then you ignored my comment about bringing the entire central banking system down. Maybe you can't even fathom that viewpoint because of your limited views on the world. And don't say you don't love billionaires. You read and watch their propaganda every single day and then come regurgitate it here.

 

[Xzi]

But I'm told all Rethuglicans are liars. Which is it?

Those who still have something to lose continue lying to cover for their wannabe mob boss. When they retire from politics and/or speak negatively about Trump from a non-elected position, you know it's because they're free from the burden of ass-kissing.

Then you ignored my comment about bringing the entire central banking system down.

How would that work if you also insist on billionaires keeping the entirety of their ill-gotten fortunes? Hint: you'd have to redistribute the money to the people who actually worked for it.

 

[TraderPatTX]

Those who still have something to lose continue lying to cover for their wannabe mob boss. When they retire from politics and/or speak negatively about Trump from a non-elected position, you know it's because they're free from the burden of ass-kissing.

So it wouldn't have anything to do with all of their potential book deals, right? Expand your thinking.

How would that work if you also insist on billionaires keeping the entirety of their ill-gotten fortunes? Hint: you'd have to redistribute the money to the people who actually worked for it.

The dollar has been devalued over 90% since 1913. Devaluing the currency is what made these billionaires. You are protecting the people who created every single billionaire in existence. And guess what? They are infinitely more rich than the billionaires you rail against because you only scream at things you can see in front of your face instead of looking deeper.

When I say that you have a limited worldview, don't take it as an insult. Take it as inspiration. I think you can be more than what you are, but the choice is yours.

 

[LainaGabranth]

So it wouldn't have anything to do with all of their potential book deals, right? Expand your thinking.

The dollar has been devalued over 90% since 1913. Devaluing the currency is what made these billionaires. You are protecting the people who created every single billionaire in existence. And guess what? They are infinitely more rich than the billionaires you rail against because you only scream at things you can see in front of your face instead of looking deeper.

When I say that you have a limited worldview, don't take it as an insult. Take it as inspiration. I think you can be more than what you are, but the choice is yours.

Just so you know every single thing that TraderPatTX believes comes entirely from ultrawealthy oil barons who push Libertarianism just so that easily duped puppets (that means you Trader) will be convinced to let them have more of their money

 

[Xzi]

So it wouldn't have anything to do with all of their potential book deals, right? Expand your thinking.

Being that book deals are a dime a dozen regardless of party affiliation, I don't believe that really has anything to do with it, no. It only limits which TV networks/shows are willing to promote your book for you.

The dollar has been devalued over 90% since 1913. Devaluing the currency is what made these billionaires.

That's a very small part of it, and the devaluing of currency is caused in large part by the hoarding of wealth, it's cyclical. Trickle-down economics, the idea that "greed is good," pathetically low tax rates on the rich, corporate welfare, lobbying, and the exploitation of labor are all factors in creating billionaires.

They are infinitely more rich than the billionaires you rail against because you only scream at things you can see in front of your face instead of looking deeper.

Do you really think I'm excluding bankers when I say, "billionaires should not exist?" Because I most certainly am not. There's no ethical way to make a billion dollars, period. If they want to make it impossible to legally tax or re-distribute their wealth back down to reasonable levels, then they'll have to eventually deal with a French-style revolution instead.

 

[TraderPatTX]

Being that book deals are a dime a dozen regardless of party affiliation, I don't believe that really has anything to do with it, no. It only limits which TV networks/shows are willing to promote your book for you.

Book deals are so much more than that.

That's a very small part of it, and the devaluing of currency is caused in large part by the hoarding of wealth, it's cyclical. Trickle-down economics, the idea that "greed is good," pathetically low tax rates on the rich, corporate welfare, lobbying, and the exploitation of labor are all factors in creating billionaires.

Why is it a small part of it? Because you say so? Inflation is too many dollars chasing too few goods, so if billionaires were hoarding wealth, there wouldn't be as many dollars in circulation and we wouldn't have inflation. Once again, you are regurgitating what the billionaires' media empires tell you without understanding what you are saying.

Do you really think I'm excluding bankers when I say, "billionaires should not exist?" Because I most certainly am not. There's no ethical way to make a billion dollars, period. If they want to make it impossible to legally tax or re-distribute their wealth back down to reasonable levels, then they'll have to eventually deal with a French-style revolution instead.

Do you really think I'm talking about the regular bankers at Bank of America and JP Morgan Chase? Because I most certainly am not. The central banks of each country is there to enslave the citizens of those countries. They create wars and social programs so countries are forced to borrow money from them to make the people debt slaves. They are the most evil and vile organizations and the left are afraid to even talk about them, much less do anything about them. This is why I don't play the Rep vs Dem team sports game. People like Mitch McConnell, Mitt Romney and Lindsay Graham work hand in hand with Chuck Schumer and Diane Feinstein.

How are you gonna have a French-style revolution when everybody you support want to confiscate guns? Are you some big 2nd Amendment supporter now?