Should There Be Tougher Gun Laws?

[dickfour]

And what if there were no guns? Does anyone think that the lack of a gun could have stopped this person from carrying out this mass killing? What's he going to say "oh can't get a gun guess I can't kill people" or is he going to build a fertilizer bomb and blow up the whole school? You can also kill 27 people with a knife or a car. It's been done but no one seems to be in favor of banning cooking knives

 

[Foxi4]

And what if there were no guns? Does anyone think that the lack of a gun could have stopped this person from carrying out this massive? What's he going to say "oh can't get a gun guess I can kill people" or is he going to buold a fertilizer bomb and blow up the whole school? You can also kill 27 people with a knife or a car. It's been done but no one seems to be in favor of banning cooking knives

Banning firearms is retarded - prohibition never goes well. What matters is that only authorized, responsible parties should get their hands on firearms. You can only drive if you have a driving license - you should only be able to purchase firearms if you have a license as well. Thing is, license-related legislature cannot be too lenient - there are certain requirements for a driver's license, a gun-related license should have steep requirements as well.

 

[Tom]

Actually


The right to bear arms in the US is only for a Militia, if you are not part of a Militia, then you you have right to bear arms.
Not to mention guns aren't really a natural right to own, it's a privileged. We are allowed to own guns, but that also means that we can lose that right at any time.

We need to regulate the amount of guns we have flowing this country. They have been become far to readily available to just anyone anywhere. We've gone way beyond protection and hunting into plain obsession at this point.

You are American right? It's in the our constitution, the second amendment. It "protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms"

 

[DinohScene]

People will find ways to obtain guns.

It's not that difficult so outlawing guns is unnecessary.
There will always be a couple of maniacs that go around and start mass shooting people.
It's how the world is unfortunately.

 

[The Catboy]

You are American right? It's in the our constitution, the second amendment. It "protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms"

Yes I am American, but looking at this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_Constitution_of_the_United_States#Text
It seems to only apply to a Militia, I could be reading that wrong and if I am, I apologize.

But with that said, I am going to agree with Foxi4 on this one. There no point banning them since that doesn't work, but there needs to be more regulates on them and apply a licencing for them and testing to make sure less guns get into the wrong hands. As well more gun safety education. It won't stop gun problems, but it will at least bring it down a notch.

 

[Foxi4]

You are American right? It's in the our constitution, the second amendment. It "protects the right of the people to keep and bear arms"

It's funny how you adamantly protect outdated legislature rather than your native tongue, American English.

My point being, this legislature was prepared in turbulent times when Americans were under an actual threat of annexation and/or internal turmoil - this threat is now non-existant. Outdated legislature needs to be revised. Moreover, a right to bear arms is not infringed upon if said right is regulated. By your definition, we should release all prisoners from prisons regardless of their crimes because they have a right to freedom.

Yes I am American, but looking at this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_Constitution_of_the_United_States#Text
It seems to only apply to a Militia, I could be reading that wrong and if I am, I apologize.

It's for both militia and individual use, and there's nothing wrong with that. What needs to be adjusted are the laws regulating said right.

 

[The Catboy]

t's for both militia and individual use, and there's nothing wrong with that. What needs to be adjusted are the laws regulating said right.

Ah, I have been reading that wrong, thank you for correcting me . Either way, we as a country really need to update the Constitution, at this point it really doesn't quite reflect our current nation anymore.

 

[Gahars]

I certainly agree that we need stricter gun control laws in place. It's not about banning guns outright - it's about ensuring that only people fit to handle guns are able to purchase them (to fullest extent that the government can ensure that, anyway).

However, that alone isn't enough. While all too many seem eager to shred our social services, that would be a serious mistake. We need to find those mentally unstable enough to commit an atrocity like this one and reach out to them; we need to make sure they get the treatment they need. Leave them to their own devices, leave families with nowhere to turn to, and you're asking for tragedy.

We also need to cut down on the wild sensationalism these stories receive from the media. These killers, more often than not, are after the glamour and glitz; they all want to be the next Harris and Klebold. When we form media parades around these massacres, we are giving those responsible exactly what they wanted.

 

[Foxi4]

I certainly agree that we need stricter gun control laws in place. It's not about banning guns outright - it's about ensuring that only people fit to handle guns are able to purchase them (to fullest extent that the government can ensure that, anyway).

However, that alone isn't enough. While all too many seem eager to shred our social services, that would be a serious mistake. We need to find those mentally unstable enough to commit an atrocity like this one and reach out to them; we need to make sure they get the treatment they need. Leave them to their own devices, leave families with nowhere to turn to, and you're asking for tragedy.

We also need to cut down on the wild sensationalism these stories receive from the media. These killers, more often than not, are after the glamour and glitz; they all want to be the next Harris and Klebold. When we form media parades around these massacres, we are giving those responsible exactly what they wanted.

I couldn't have worded it any better, so I "Quote for Truth" - you're getting a well-deserved Like.

 

[InuYasha]

While in theory there should be tougher laws but if you really think about it most mass killings the gunman kills themselves anyway...

 

[Hanafuda]

"After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it. I sure as hell wouldn't want to live in a society where the only people allowed guns are the police and the military." -- William S. Bourroughs


Edit:

Yes I am American, but looking at this
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Amendment_to_the_Constitution_of_the_United_States#Text
It seems to only apply to a Militia, I could be reading that wrong and if I am, I apologize.
.

The Supreme Court says it is an individual right - D.C. v. Heller in 2008 and in McDonald v. Chicago in 2010.

 

[Foxi4]

"After a shooting spree, they always want to take the guns away from the people who didn't do it. I sure as hell wouldn't want to live in a society where the only people allowed guns are the police and the military." -- William S. Bourroughs

Who says anything about "taking away guns from the people who didn't do it"? We're talking about introducing policy of gun ownership control that would prevent tragedies from happening by monitoring the mental state as well as abilities and preparation of those who own guns as well as those who wish to own them.

I'll give you an example - where I live, to own a gun you need to pass a psychological test at any of the certified psychlogist offices, a psychological, theoretical and practical test at the P.D (including actual weapon handling, maintenance etc.) and, if applies, present factual evidence that a weapon you wish to own is required by you for:

• Self-defense purposes, in which case you need to present an actual situation you find life-threatening - a court statement in relation to some kind of a previous offense you were the victim of speeds up the process, but isn't necessary. If your request is accepted, you may be permitted to bear small semi-automatic guns.
• Proof of being a part of a hunting-related organisation, as well as a result of a membership test performed in said organisation. If your request is accepted, you may be permitted to bear larger, hunting-related weaponry, rifles and shotguns included.
• Proof of being a part of a marksmanship organisation and proof of taking part in competitions on a national level within a given marksmanship-related sport. If your request is accepted, you may bear arms with sport-related purposes within designated areas.

All those still require you to take psychological tests each 5 years. You are also required to have two safes in your house, both mounted within walls to prevent them from being burglarized. One is for ammunition, and another, in another room is dedicated for the guns themselves. In certain circumstances, guns may be kept outside of the safe (self-defense).
Now, this isn't ideal - I think that the regulations are slightly too harsh, but honestly, I'm 23 years old and I don't remember a single shooting incident occurring in a Polish school. Ever. In Poland, you don't just "own a gun", you actually earn it.

 

[Wizerzak]

And what if there were no guns? Does anyone think that the lack of a gun could have stopped this person from carrying out this mass killing? What's he going to say "oh can't get a gun guess I can't kill people" or is he going to build a fertilizer bomb and blow up the whole school? You can also kill 27 people with a knife or a car. It's been done but no one seems to be in favor of banning cooking knives

You obviously didn't read my post (1st reply).

 

[Deleted member 318366]

You obviously didn't read my post (1st reply).

No i read it, sorry bro i get sidetracked alot sometimes but yeah i totally agree with you.

I think we can and cant live without guns, udderly it must be the circle of life i guess.

Did i read it wrong or is the killer now adam lanza? Abc news had said it was ryan lanza for hours at first, cbs news had corrected there version of the story and turns out the brother is not dead after all too btw.

 

[gamefan5]

I only partially agree with Wizerzak. Gun control should be enhanced, but in the sense of annual psychological tests for gun owners as well as a more selective gun license distribution. I find it ridiculous that guns in the U.S can be simply picked up at K-Mart - the constitutional right for owning guns applies, but only when the future owner is responsible, mentally stable and is able to make sure that neither children nor burglars will have access to it. It's also a matter of what kind of guns are put on the market - let's face it, you don't need fully-automatic assault rifles for self-defense and you don't need a SPAS-12 for hunting - combat firearms like those should not be available for purchase by civilians without sufficient licenses (for example when said civilians run a shooting range or when they're required for some sort of sport events).

With the degree of firearm saturation we're seeing in the U.S, even in the event of totally banning the sale of firearms, people would still get their hands on some relatively easily - prohibition is never a good idea. What needs to be implemented is education concerning guns, their use and appropriate behaviour when facing attackers wielding them. Constitution aside, the U.S is no longer "Wild West" and the country cannot go on following the same laws that were put in place when its citizens were under an actual threat, be it in form of indians or other parties.

Whoa whoa whoa, They SELL guns at K-mart???
(I live in Canada, hence the question)

 

[Foxi4]

Whoa whoa whoa, They SELL guns at K-mart???
(I live in Canada, hence the question)

They used to, and from what I'm reading online, they still do in some areas, although they promised to "phase out" this section of their stores. That's besides the point though, I used the store name in a metaphorical sense - what I actually meant was that "gun store" should not be associated with "supermarket" under any circumstances - these are not groceries, these are weapons and should be sold only at specialized, high-security stores.

 

[gamefan5]

They used to, and from what I'm reading online, they still do in some areas, although they promised to "phase out" this section of their stores. That's besides the point though, I used the store name in a metaphorical sense - what I actually meant was that "gun store" should not be associated with "supermarket" under any circumstances - these are not groceries, these are weapons and should be sold only at specialized, high-security stores.

No argument here, but if i get this right, they can be found in other type of stores that doesn't have that much security?

 

[Foxi4]

No argument here, but if i get this right, they can be found in other type of stores that doesn't have that much security?

Very much so - I used K-Mart's name due to its infamy in the subject, really. It was merely an example.

Taken at Wal-Mart. Recipe for disaster.

1. Acquire ammunition beforehand, enter the store.
2. Ask the clerk to "test drive" a rifle.
3. ...
4. Massacre!

What is this I don't even.

 

[gamefan5]

Very much so - I used K-Mart's name due to its infamy in the subject, really. It was merely an example.

Taken at Wal-Mart. Recipe for disaster.

1. Acquire ammunition beforehand, enter the store.
2. Ask the clerk to "test drive" a rifle (do note that the clerk is nowhere to be seen in the photo).
3. ...
4. Massacre!

What is this I don't even.

WTF??? O.O

 

[RodrigoDavy]

I don't know how US laws work, but I think it would be good to have more rigids rule about firearms.

First, one have to know how to use a gun, otherwise he/she could kill a person by accident. I've even heard stories about people shooting themselves by accident.
Second, every person that intend to buy a gun must be registered. When you have a car, you must register the car. Why not do the same for firearms?
Third, the person must be checked to see if he/she is mentally healthy, doesn't have depression, etc...